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| Don't the coaches always know more than fans | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Jun 15 2012, 08:07 AM (610 Views) | |
| BJVOL III | Jun 15 2012, 08:07 AM Post #1 |
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Awesome
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Every time Tennessee recruits someone who doesn't have enough stars for fans, some poster will say the coaches know more than the fans. That's true at every college. It comes down to who the school can attract. Take Duke for example. I am sure Cut knows more than the fans but is limited to certain type of players. So when you hear the Tenn coaches know more than the fans, instead just ask if the recruit is good enough for the current elite programs. |
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| *TennesseeTuxedo | Jun 15 2012, 08:18 AM Post #2 |
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and that makes some fans smart? |
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| LonzoVol | Jun 15 2012, 08:26 AM Post #3 |
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Some kids don't blow Up until their senior seasons. I assume the OP is a back handed swipe at the Barnes kid who just committed. He has been very impressive at combine and in individual workouts for UT coaches, not for Bertrand Simmons, err Barton Simonton, err whatever. Of course, there are internet experts such as the InjunVol who have been annointed as recruiting gurus even though many of them wouldn't know a good player if they tripped over him. This new staff is loaded with highly regarded recruiters and certainly a veteran coach like Sunseri is not going to offer a marginal player this early. We shall see if their evaluations are correct in due time. Meanwhile, let the internet gurus and pay site jock sniffers roll on. Winning will stop the hand wringing, wailing and moaning quicker than anything else. |
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| *OrangeRev | Jun 15 2012, 08:39 AM Post #4 |
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Tree hug'n, bleed'n heart, lazy luv'n, global warm'n token liberal
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That's true ... the criteria I use with a recruit is simply, "Is he an SEC-caliber player?" And, if fans see a 4- or 5-star recruiting service label on the player, then we naturally assume "SEC-caliber" ... if it is 3-star, then perhaps ... if it is 2-star, then no. In other words, a sports writer thinks the player is high quality. Really? In our current world, a sports writer who looked at a highlight film is my key to knowing whether or not a player is going to be successful in the SEC? And, then a coach of a major SEC University watches the SAME film and then runs the prospect through a day or two of drills, combines, academic evaluations, attitude evaluations, and work-ethic evaluations come up the declaration that "this is an SEC caliber player worthy of a scholarship" ... So, we have two opinions. That of a sports-writer and that of a coach ... if the sports-writer is wrong a lot (and they are), then they move onto the next season. If the coach is wrong, he is fired. |
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| *JollyVolly | Jun 15 2012, 08:55 AM Post #5 |
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A Very Manly Man
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I would say that 95% of the coaches know more than 95% of the fans. It's not like coaching is rocket surgery....but I wouldn't tell Dooley how to recruit any more than I'd want him to tell me how to stop terrorist vehicles laden with explosives from crashing into buildings (one of the things our company does). We've got 11 commitments right now. A few might be head scratchers, but honestly, I don't think Dooley's pouring over recruiting sites circling the five stars. He and his staff have been giving them the once, twice and thrice look overs and pulling the triggers on the ones they like. Frankly.....so far, it seems to be working pretty well. He's done a good job of restocking the shelves at a point where the UT brand is suffering. |
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| *OrangeRev | Jun 15 2012, 09:24 AM Post #6 |
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Tree hug'n, bleed'n heart, lazy luv'n, global warm'n token liberal
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And, in my eyes, Dooley's approach and effectiveness with recruiting is not a question mark. I've been VERY satisfied with his ability to recruit. Now, I've got other concerns with the Doolanator, but recruiting (and player evaluation) is not one of them. Edited by OrangeRev, Jun 15 2012, 09:24 AM.
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| *TennesseeTuxedo | Jun 15 2012, 10:02 AM Post #7 |
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What we have are some fans who worship the stars by the name and don't know squat about talent evaluation. They keep the recruiting mags in business. Why aren't the recruiting mag writers in the coaching business if they are so savvy in recruiting? |
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| *TennesseeTuxedo | Jun 15 2012, 10:10 AM Post #8 |
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I'll also add that the Vols have had more talent in their campus than any coach has had in over a decade. The coaches are doing something right. They are offering kids who competed against the star owners and competed with them at the same level. The coaches know what they are doing and know when they see talent. There isn't one fan out there who is more in-touch with the kids and their talent evaluations than the coaches...and they are seeing the talent first hand, not just on film and on a printed page filled with stars. |
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| *OrangeRev | Jun 15 2012, 10:17 AM Post #9 |
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Tree hug'n, bleed'n heart, lazy luv'n, global warm'n token liberal
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Actually, a better question would be ... Do you want our staff to use the recruiting mag writers for recruiting evaluations, or do you want our staff to bring in the athletes and do the evaluations? In later years, Fulmer did the former, and look how that turned out for us. |
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| BJVOL III | Jun 15 2012, 10:26 AM Post #10 |
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Awesome
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Another point--coaches look for different qualities in a player. The SEC for a long time was about the only conference that put a lot of emphasis on speed. The Big Ten didn't. It's changing everywhere now. The Wisconsin coach emphasizes size in his offensive linemen more than most coaches. But remember when Tenn went after small linebackers who were fast. Bigger linebackers with good speed are more valued now. |
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| humbletx | Jun 15 2012, 10:39 AM Post #11 |
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Whew - Ag.. #1 - go and watch high school football. It's really that simple. Evaluations - talk with high school coaches, and yep that is what Dooley and his staff do - and yep that is a major piece of their evaluation process. Eye balling a kid - the basic metrics height, weight, speed, etc. is "observable" by simply watching the kids play in high school. Doley doesn't do anything different that a majority of head football coaches in the SEC or elsewhere. Example the DFW area lets say for example you're one of the dominating players at Skyline - and a starter since the 10th grade.. Euless Trinity, Grand Prairie, Carrollton, Plano, Allen. You're a pretty good player. Or in our area - Lufkin, Longview, Tyler, Killeen, Woodlands, Ike, North Shore, Pearland, Dekaney, Klein, Westfield, Cypress, Alief. same thing applies. There are some outstanding high school coaches - and they are open and honest with every college coach they talk to. A good example Bob Stoops rolled in to a local HS and asked a head coach *if* there was a player being overlooked - that was Oklahoma good. Said HS coach told him about a 5'4" RB signed a ship - and was a damned good one for the Sooners - helped them win a couple conference championships and a BCS title. Good enough to play pro ball for a few years. The mindless yapping about 5 star players - well there aren't many 5 star players in the first place - and IMO based on how they've been evaluated by a number of coaching staffs - there is some potential there. And FWIW - there are 5 or 6 - 5 star 2013 recruits I'd be more than happy to see being Tennessee commitments. |
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| LonzoVol | Jun 15 2012, 10:43 AM Post #12 |
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Aren't U forgetting the most profound statement ever made on a UT board? To wit: "Coaching isn't rocket science, it's harder than that!"-- Glock/Porche12 in defense of Moby Phil during some of the darkest days of Tennessee football. |
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| humbletx | Jun 15 2012, 10:52 AM Post #13 |
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Now how the hell does Dooley and his staff evaluate so many players - to the point having made over 200 scholar ship offers? I know they are good at their jobs, recruiting wise - but I have a difficult time believing they are somehow better than Saban and his bunch - who IIRC have made < 80 offers. Out of that 200 plus number - how many would fall in to the top 300 recruits nationally? I didn't realize so many kids have made the trip to Knoxville to be evaluated by Dooley and the coaching staff. |
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| *TennesseeTuxedo | Jun 15 2012, 11:13 AM Post #14 |
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Several do Milton. You are too caught up in numbers Milton Friedman. |
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| BJVOL III | Jun 15 2012, 11:27 AM Post #15 |
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Awesome
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Humble It's really not that simple selecting recruits. Most recruiting services and coaches will tell that out of 20 recruits, 2 will be different makers, 8 will will be starters one time or another, and 10 will be contributors or wash out of the program. |
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