| Ben Aflac is a moron | |
|---|---|
| Tweet Topic Started: Oct 6 2014, 07:04 PM (2,448 Views) | |
| split decision | Oct 11 2014, 02:53 AM Post #46 |
|
Porn savant
|
I hope your pc helps you explain. You're saying that 1 in 5 American Muslims find it acceptable to resort to suicide bombing under some circumstances. I don't know if that is actually true. Regardless, I'm asking you when the bad, scary American Muslims have actually committed such acts. Thinking does not equal doing in all cases. |
![]() |
|
| split decision | Oct 11 2014, 10:25 AM Post #47 |
|
Porn savant
|
This obviously isn't a cut and dried issue -- I'm not defending all Muslims and you, Nate, are not saying all Muslims are bad (although you have more than once thrown out a "nuke them all" or "nuke the whole fucking Middle East" type of statement, which I'm admittedly too easily baited by). I'm all for empowering the moderates, who do exist (again, despite Bill Maher's snide remark that they're impossible to find). Regarding the 19% of U.S. Muslims who supposedly find it justifiable to be a suicide bomber in some instances, fuck those guys. I'm not defending them. They should all change their thinking. Before I move on, I would hazard a guess that probably close to 19% of Americans would respond positively when asked, "Is it justifiable to shoot someone who comes onto your property unannounced or uninvited?" Personally, I think that's an overreaction, too extreme. But those sort of individuals are out there too. Also among those who should change their thinking: Muslims who treat women like dirt, Muslims who think you ought to die if you leave the religion and Muslims who think gays should be killed. What does that leave? Maybe it's only a small portion of adherents to Islam. But I bet it's still hundreds of millions of people. I'll stand up for those people, even though I don't share their belief in religion. You know, many of those who practice religion only pick and choose the tenets they like. Some look beyond the relatively few lines of scripture that promote violence (and I think the fact that any religion promotes violence -- and the Old Testament is rife with it -- is ridiculous). And some in the Middle East are more influenced by wrongheaded social norms, poverty and lack of education than they are by religion. Others, like ISIS, emphasize those passages in the Quran or, more so in the Hadith, relating to violence, especially jihad, and act on them. I hope they all enjoy a fiery death. But, again, for the Muslims who are not filled rage or malice, I believe they have a right to peacefully practice their religion. What gets under my skin is remarks from Maher, Harris, members of this forum and others who just lump Muslims all together. It happens all the time, despite some of those same individuals later acknowledging that not all Muslims are the same. Sometimes those sweeping statements happen in an attempt to be funny, sometimes out of simplicity in making an argument. But they're wrong. The generalizations are what elicit a response from me. |
![]() |
|
| 19nate79 | Oct 11 2014, 07:39 PM Post #48 |
|
http://www.samharris.org/ Another link in this thread for you to go to The pew poll results are I'm here too if you want those numbers I'm quoting |
![]() |
|
| Skeletonrock | Oct 12 2014, 05:13 PM Post #49 |
![]()
|
Fareed has some merit, but so does Maher. Why do you guys always pick sides as if anything In life was black & white? Here's what I don't get: where is the outrage from gracious, progressive Muslims who are apparently (according to Splittle and Afleck) the vast majority? Why aren't they marching in the PRIDE parade showing that they love gays? Where are the mass protests against violence? Where is the Muslim Scholarship Fund for Young Women? Are there crazy Christians who make death threat? A small number. But if T.D. Jakes, Joel Olstein, and Billy Graham all Came out and said we need to punish women for going to school or kill the gays or something else equally ridiculous, you would be safe to safe Christianity has a problem. |
![]() |
|
| split decision | Oct 12 2014, 05:30 PM Post #50 |
|
Porn savant
|
I'm not saying it's the vast majority who are moderate/progressive. It may actually be a minority. But that's still hundreds of millions of Muslims. Again, I don't condone discrimination against women or gays. Not from Muslims, not from Christians, not from anyone. There are some Muslim leaders who have spoken out against 9-11 and against ISIS. Why aren't there more? Why aren't there people demonstrating in the streets? One factor could be fear and intimidation. ISIS is slaughtering people en masse and posting it to social media. Not too many people are willing to make themselves targets with these guys running roughshod. Here's an article on that very topic from just a few days ago. Some are willing to voice their opposition, others are not for their own reasons: Here's Why These Muslims Are Refusing To Criticize ISIS American Muslim leaders gathered at Washington's National Press Club late last month to release a scathing 17-page letter to the Islamic State that distanced mainstream Muslims from the militant group's actions. But one prominent imam from Northern Virginia refused to give his endorsement. "It sounded like they were apologizing for something they haven't done, like they were running for cover," Imam Johari Abdul-Malik said in an interview with The Huffington Post. President Barack Obama has called on the world's Muslims to "explicitly, forcefully and consistently reject" the Islamic State, also known as ISIS, while Secretary of State John Kerry recently said that Muslims need to "reclaim Islam." In response, some of the largest Muslim organizations have issued sweeping condemnations of the militant group's extremism. The letter unveiled at the National Press Club had the signatures of 126 prominent Islamic scholars, including the grand muftis of Egypt, Jerusalem, Bulgaria and Kosovo. But not all Muslims have engaged in these condemnations. Many have written blog posts and created social media campaigns to criticize what they see as Muslim institutions' knee-jerk instinct to decry faraway atrocities that are unconnected to their communities. "Dr. King said we are all caught up in a network of mutuality -- whatever affects one directly will indirectly affect the other," Abdul-Malik said. "If I speak up against ISIS, it's because I'm a human being, not because I'm a Muslim." Abdul-Malik has spoken frequently of the Islamic State in his Friday sermons at Dar Al-Hijrah mosque in Falls Church, Virginia. His mosque is one of the largest Islamic prayer centers in the Washington, D.C. area, serving 3,000 worshippers each Friday. "I talk about it because I want to tell our community to keep their heads up," he said. "I talk about it so young people don't get caught up in any false theology." Abdul-Malik is one of many Muslims who have found themselves in an ongoing debate as global concern grows over the Islamist movement in Syria and Iraq. They're having lively conversations at mosques and universities, in living rooms and on social media about how much Muslims should condemn the Islamic State -- or if they should do so at all. "When you ask Muslims to condemn or denounce heinous actions, ideologies or groups what you’re saying is that you don’t trust any Muslim," Sana Saeed, a San Francisco-based producer at the digital Al Jazeera channel AJ+, wrote in a recent blog post, "Why I Won't Condemn ISIS. "[Y]ou're saying that I can’t be trusted until and unless I vocalize dissent against an individual, an action, an ideology or a group that claims to do something in the name of a shared identity." Saeed said she was "tired of people in my communities constantly partaking in and creating public campaigns to put up a good face of our religion." However, she added that she "can’t blame them for trying to show how they practice, envision and know Islam." Maha Hilal, a 32-year-old Muslim activist and post-doctoral researcher in Arlington, Virginia, also agrees that Muslims at large should not feel compelled to defend Islam. "When I am watching TV and I see pictures of ISIS fighters, I don't feel any relation to them, I don't feel any connection to their theology," said Hilal, who serves as the Director of Outreach and Member Engagement at the Peace and Collaborative Development Network. "I want Muslims to get to the point where we see an act of terror and don't have to think, 'How will I get blamed?'" Hilal admits that it could be beneficial for American Muslims to forcefully condemn the extremists, given that negative views about Islam are widespread. A Pew Research Center survey released in September found that half of Americans believe Islam is more likely than other religions to encourage violence. It's these kinds of views that spur Amanda Quraishi, a 40-year-old technical consultant and interfaith activist in Austin, Texas, to spend her spare time promoting positive images of Islam at community events and in online forums. "There's a fine line between apologizing for ISIS and proactively contradicting false narratives about Islam," said Qureshi, who serves on the board of directors at several faith-based organizations. "We are at a point in time where we have to bear the burden of wide-scale fear and misinformation about our faith and the cultures of many of the people who practice it … I quite literally view it as our jihad." For other Muslims, it's simply a religious obligation to condemn extremism. "The prophet, peace be upon him, said the entire [Muslim world] is one human body. If one does something bad, it affects everyone. That's why it's our duty to speak out," said Imam Shafayat Mohamed, who leads the Darul Uloom mosque in Pembroke Pines, Florida. "It's not optional." Mohamed said he talks frequently about the Islamic State at his mosque and on his online Islamic TV channel, Al-Hikmat. "We won't be punished on the day of judgement for others' crimes, but we will be questioned about whether or not we tried to stop people from committing them." In response to the Islamic State's brutalities, British Muslims last month started a wildly popular social media campaign around the hashtag #NotInMyName, which Obama recognized in his recent United Nations speech. Muslims participating in the campaign posed with signs that say "Not In My Name" to denounce extremists who say they act in the name of Islam. Hilal, Saeed and thousands of other Muslims expressed their views under a different banner, #MuslimApologies, in which Muslims sarcastically tweeted apologies for things that aren't offensive. Many of the tweets highlighted Muslim inventions, like algebra and kebabs. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/10/06/muslims-condemn-isis-debate_n_5927772.html |
![]() |
|
| best80smovierad | Oct 12 2014, 05:57 PM Post #51 |
![]()
|
in the words of strongo for the last like 20 posts
|
![]() |
|
| split decision | Oct 12 2014, 06:04 PM Post #52 |
|
Porn savant
|
^^^ Wouldn't expect you to show any interest in this thread anyway. No discussion of Nike shoes or MMA here. ![]() |
![]() |
|
| best80smovierad | Oct 12 2014, 06:05 PM Post #53 |
![]()
|
But you are talking about BATMAN!!!!!
|
![]() |
|
| split decision | Oct 12 2014, 06:13 PM Post #54 |
|
Porn savant
|
|
![]() |
|
| best80smovierad | Oct 12 2014, 06:17 PM Post #55 |
![]()
|
|
![]() |
|
| split decision | Oct 12 2014, 06:22 PM Post #56 |
|
Porn savant
|
I think you have actually made an important contribution here, Best80s. If people around the globe could unite behind dancing Batman, then the world would be a much better place!
|
![]() |
|
| best80smovierad | Oct 12 2014, 06:32 PM Post #57 |
![]()
|
People need dramatic examples to shake them out of apathy, and I can’t do that as Best80s. As a man, I’m flesh and blood; I can be ignored, I can be destroyed. But as a symbol… as a symbol I can be incorruptible. I can be everlasting. |
![]() |
|
| Tallica | Oct 12 2014, 06:33 PM Post #58 |
![]()
|
gay |
![]() |
|
| best80smovierad | Oct 12 2014, 06:36 PM Post #59 |
![]()
|
|
![]() |
|
| Skeletonrock | Oct 12 2014, 06:45 PM Post #60 |
![]()
|
Split, you are making Maher's case for him. You're saying there's a good chance it's a minority? Well, then Islam as a whole has problem. If I say there is an obesity epidemic in America you can't point to Lebron James and Rich Froning and say, "Nuh-uh! Look at these guys! They're Americans and they're crazy fit! No epidemic here!" The facts are that adults age 20 years and over who are overweight, including obesity: 69.0% That's the majority, and so therefore America has an obesity problem. And your argument that people don't speak up because they don't want to get MURDERED? How does that help your argument that Islam (as an institution, not a theory) is not a violent, oppressive religion? |
![]() |
|
| 1 user reading this topic (1 Guest and 0 Anonymous) | |
![]() Join the millions that use us for their forum communities. Create your own forum today. Learn More · Sign-up for Free |
|
| Go to Next Page | |
| « Previous Topic · General Discussion · Next Topic » |











3:01 AM Jul 13