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1-drop rule' appears to persist for biracial individuals
Topic Started: Dec 10 2010, 08:48 PM (6,799 Views)
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'1-drop rule' appears to persist for biracial individuals
People consistently view biracials as members of their lower-status parent group

CAMBRIDGE, Mass., Dec. 9, 2010 -- The centuries-old "one-drop rule" assigning minority status to mixed-race individuals appears to live on in our modern-day perception and categorization of people like Barack Obama, Tiger Woods, and Halle Berry.

So say Harvard University psychologists, who've found that we still tend to see biracials not as equal members of both parent groups, but as belonging more to their minority parent group. Their research appears in the Journal of Personality and Social Psychology.

"Many commentators have argued that the election of Barack Obama, and the increasing number of mixed-race people more broadly, will lead to a fundamental change in American race relations," says lead author Arnold K. Ho, a Ph.D. student in psychology at Harvard. "Our work challenges the interpretation of our first biracial president, and the growing number of mixed-race people in general, as signaling a color-blind America."

In the U.S., the "one-drop rule" -- also known as hypodescent -- dates to a 1662 Virginia law on the treatment of mixed-race individuals. The legal notion of hypodescent has been upheld as recently as 1985, when a Louisiana court ruled that a woman with a black great-great-great-great-grandmother could not identify herself as "white" on her passport.

"One of the remarkable things about our research on hypodescent is what it tells us about the hierarchical nature of race relations in the United States," says co-author James Sidanius, professor of psychology and of African and African American studies at Harvard. "Hypodescent against blacks remains a relatively powerful force within American society."

Ho and Sidanius, along with co-authors Mahzarin R. Banaji at Harvard and Daniel T. Levin at Vanderbilt University, say their work reflects the cultural entrenchment of America's traditional racial hierarchy, which assigns the highest status to whites, followed by Asians, with Latinos and blacks at the bottom.

Ho and colleagues presented subjects with computer-generated images of black-white and Asian-white individuals, as well as family trees showing different biracial permutations. They also asked people to report directly whether they perceived biracials to be more minority or white. By using multiple approaches, their work examined both conscious and unconscious perceptions of biracial individuals, presenting the most extensive empirical evidence to date on how they are perceived.

The researchers found, for example, that one-quarter-Asian individuals are consistently considered more white than one-quarter-black individuals, despite the fact that African Americans and European Americans share a substantial degree of genetic heritage.

Using face-morphing technology that presented a series of faces ranging from 5 percent white to 95 percent white, they also found that individuals who were a 50-50 mix of two races, either black-white or Asian-white, were almost never identified by study participants as white. Furthermore, on average black-white biracials had to be 68 percent white before they were perceived as white; the comparable figure for Asian-white biracials was 63 percent.

"The United States is already a country of ethnic mixtures, but in the near future it will be even more so, and more so than any other country on earth," says Banaji, Richard Clarke Cabot Professor of Social Ethics at Harvard. "When we see in our data that our own minds are limited in the perception of those who are the products of two different ethnic groups, we recognize how far we have to go in order to have an objectively accurate and fair assessment of people. That's the challenge for modern minds."

The team found few differences in how whites and non-whites perceive biracial individuals, with both assigning them with equal frequency to lower-status groups. The researchers are conducting further studies to examine why Americans continue to associate biracials more with their minority parent group.

"The persistence of hypodescent serves to reinforce racial boundaries, rather than moving us toward a race-neutral society," Ho says.


http://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releases/2010-12/hu-ra120810.php
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luipp
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Morons. The whole point of the information given is that getting rid of blacks (and muslims and Jews too presumably) and just allowing europeans and east asians will make a more human being society that doesnt depend on racial awareness to be safe.
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Delilah
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The legal notion of hypodescent has been upheld as recently as 1985, when a Louisiana court ruled that a woman with a black great-great-great-great-grandmother could not identify herself as "white" on her passport.

This is ridiculous. Some people can't even go that far back in their family histories. That's like 6 generations back from the woman in question. If all of her other ancestors were White than she is more White than Black.

People like Obama, Berry I can understand being called Black because phenotypically they look it.

Edited by Delilah, Dec 10 2010, 11:17 PM.
"Let nothing disturb you. Let nothing frighten you. All things pass. God does not change. Patience achieves everything. Whoever has God lacks nothing. God alone suffices." St. Teresa of Avila
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luipp
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What's wrong with Mulatto? Who is she to tie others to her? Why not call all people mixed with blacks human and let the rest rot with their non human kind?
Edited by luipp, Dec 10 2010, 11:57 PM.
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Dec 10 2010, 11:16 PM
The legal notion of hypodescent has been upheld as recently as 1985, when a Louisiana court ruled that a woman with a black great-great-great-great-grandmother could not identify herself as "white" on her passport.

This is ridiculous. Some people can't even go that far back in their family histories. That's like 6 generations back from the woman in question. If all of her other ancestors were White than she is more White than Black.

People like Obama, Berry I can understand being called Black because phenotypically they look it.

Yeah, that woman would be 1/64 or 1.56% black. I've seen octoroons that look white. The SSA admixture in that woman is probably unnoticeable.

People who are considered mulatto in Latin America would be called black in the U.S.
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Berserk
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Bilbo
Dec 11 2010, 12:18 AM
Delilah
Dec 10 2010, 11:16 PM
The legal notion of hypodescent has been upheld as recently as 1985, when a Louisiana court ruled that a woman with a black great-great-great-great-grandmother could not identify herself as "white" on her passport.

This is ridiculous. Some people can't even go that far back in their family histories. That's like 6 generations back from the woman in question. If all of her other ancestors were White than she is more White than Black.

People like Obama, Berry I can understand being called Black because phenotypically they look it.

Yeah, that woman would be 1/64 or 1.56% black. I've seen octoroons that look white. The SSA admixture in that woman is probably unnoticeable.

People who are considered mulatto in Latin America would be called black in the U.S.
And people who are called white in Latin American countries would be considered non-white in America, like for instance Rick Sanchez.


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In America you have to look 100% European and not have a Hispanic name to be considered white.
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Euskal kubatarrak
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Berserk
Dec 11 2010, 05:37 AM
And people who are called white in Latin American countries would be considered non-white in America, like for instance Rick Sanchez.


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In America you have to look 100% European and not have a Hispanic name to be considered white.
Well that's a load of BS. Firstly if you are inferring that Rick Sanchez looks anything but White then please say what is the admixture you see in him. Anyways no such thing as a Hispanic name, if you mean a Spanish Surname then that's another thing, because there are Latin Americans that have Harper as their last name. Sanchez self identifies as nonwhite, I have seen plenty of people from Spain and Latin America that self identify as White and no one has come out and said they are non-white. Anyways the one drop rule didn't keep Anglo Americans from mixing, as you can see in this study:

http://s1.zetaboards.com/anthroscape/topic/3990227/1/#new

They are 93.2% European on average, with the European component going from as low as 73.23% to 98.08%. So many of those so call White American today aren't even 100% White, so the one drop rule is plain stupid, they are so freaking paranoid about portraying themselves as pure, when in fact they are as mixed as any new world population. Ironically those people not considered White at some point (Irish, Italians) are the ones probably keeping the average so high, as many Irish Americans are purely of Irish descent, for instance the Kennedy brothers, had all their great-grandparents born in Ireland. Or many Italian American who have only intermarried other Italians, those are the ones that are probably coming out 100%.

Ahhh Carlos Estevez is considered white in the US, or Emilio Estevez. If they have any admixture it must come from their American mother, definately not from their 50% Galician/50%Irish father.

I have yet to see someone calling this guy Non-White.

Albio Sires

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Edited by Euskal kubatarrak, Dec 11 2010, 06:27 AM.
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Diezmador
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Dec 11 2010, 05:37 AM
Bilbo
Dec 11 2010, 12:18 AM
Delilah
Dec 10 2010, 11:16 PM
The legal notion of hypodescent has been upheld as recently as 1985, when a Louisiana court ruled that a woman with a black great-great-great-great-grandmother could not identify herself as "white" on her passport.

This is ridiculous. Some people can't even go that far back in their family histories. That's like 6 generations back from the woman in question. If all of her other ancestors were White than she is more White than Black.

People like Obama, Berry I can understand being called Black because phenotypically they look it.

Yeah, that woman would be 1/64 or 1.56% black. I've seen octoroons that look white. The SSA admixture in that woman is probably unnoticeable.

People who are considered mulatto in Latin America would be called black in the U.S.
And people who are called white in Latin American countries would be considered non-white in America, like for instance Rick Sanchez.


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In America you have to look 100% European and not have a Hispanic name to be considered white.
Dude looks completely Caucasoid to me. I don't know if white, I'd rather not use that term.
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Swans
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I've never labelled myself with a race or ethnic group, because if you are of mixed ancestry then you're always going to have people telling you what you are supposed to be or identify as. It's best to leave it to them.

In the middle of my teens I joined a new school and the first pupils I made friends with decided that I must be Arab or Middle Eastern, and I didn't say anything. So for the next few years I completely played up to it and made up loads of stories containing the most cliched and ridiculous lies that you could imagine. You have to remember these are the kind of people that think Keanu Reeves and Vin Diesel are white guys.
Berzerk has a habit of using the same photos as examples over and over, and in a past thread he used Rick Sanchez as an example of a fully caucasoid looking individual who will often be labelled as non-white in the USA. So you guys are just misunderstanding his badly worded post, I don't think he's saying Sanchez is mixed.
Edited by Swans, Dec 12 2010, 05:07 AM.
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Berserk
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Dec 11 2010, 06:16 AM
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Dec 11 2010, 05:37 AM
And people who are called white in Latin American countries would be considered non-white in America, like for instance Rick Sanchez.


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In America you have to look 100% European and not have a Hispanic name to be considered white.
Well that's a load of BS. Firstly if you are inferring that Rick Sanchez looks anything but White then please say what is the admixture you see in him. Anyways no such thing as a Hispanic name, if you mean a Spanish Surname then that's another thing, because there are Latin Americans that have Harper as their last name. Sanchez self identifies as nonwhite, I have seen plenty of people from Spain and Latin America that self identify as White and no one has come out and said they are non-white. Anyways the one drop rule didn't keep Anglo Americans from mixing, as you can see in this study:

http://s1.zetaboards.com/anthroscape/topic/3990227/1/#new

They are 93.2% European on average, with the European component going from as low as 73.23% to 98.08%. So many of those so call White American today aren't even 100% White, so the one drop rule is plain stupid, they are so freaking paranoid about portraying themselves as pure, when in fact they are as mixed as any new world population. Ironically those people not considered White at some point (Irish, Italians) are the ones probably keeping the average so high, as many Irish Americans are purely of Irish descent, for instance the Kennedy brothers, had all their great-grandparents born in Ireland. Or many Italian American who have only intermarried other Italians, those are the ones that are probably coming out 100%.

Ahhh Carlos Estevez is considered white in the US, or Emilio Estevez. If they have any admixture it must come from their American mother, definately not from their 50% Galician/50%Irish father.

I have yet to see someone calling this guy Non-White.

Albio Sires

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I didn't say that Sanchez was mixed. My point was that if you're living in America and you either look mixed with Indian or you have a Spanish last name most of the time you will be classified as non-white or partially non-white. For instance, many Americans see Cristina Aguilera as not being fully white even though she is probably 100% European, her mother is Irish and her father is Ecuadorian. Knowing where her father is from most Americans would assume that she has some Indian in her but her father looks 100% European so I doubt that's the case:


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Edited by Berserk, Dec 12 2010, 09:37 AM.
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Euskal kubatarrak
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Dec 12 2010, 09:36 AM
I didn't say that Sanchez was mixed. My point was that if you're living in America and you either look mixed with Indian or you have a Spanish last name most of the time you will be classified as non-white or partially non-white. For instance, many Americans see Cristina Aguilera as not being fully white even though she is probably 100% European, her mother is Irish and her father is Ecuadorian. Knowing where her father is from most Americans would assume that she has some Indian in her but her father looks 100% European so I doubt that's the case:


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Well that is kind of subjective I think, many people don't consider Cameron Diaz to be anything but White. Or Emilio Estevez, or Luis Alvarez. There are many people here too that claim Native American descent yet they are considered White, so it's sort of a double standard then. Anyways, it depends how the individuals identifies itself, for example Cameron Diaz, Emilio Estevez and Luis Alvarez don't identify with the Latin American community, yet Christina Aguilera does, and she even has songs in Spanish. So like I said it depends. I heard that Antonio Banderas was shocked when he first came to the US, and found out they did not consider him White. Also in the movie "Disaster Movie", they satirize the character played by Javier Barden in "No Country for old Man" as the "creepy Mexican dude", even though Barden is Spanish.
Anyways these people even though they carry Spanish surnames are usually thought as being White by the average americans.

Emilio Estevez
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Luis Alvarez

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Cameron Diaz(Who turns out has known Amerindian Ancestry via her American mom)

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Joanna Garcia

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Albio Sires

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The last two are full blooded Cubans, but since they look like WASPs types, people usually don't see them as anything else than White. In your head though you are equating White to WASPs.

Anyways, my take on this was that White Americans as a whole are a mixed group, so the one drop rule did not keep them from mixing, also they carry SSA blood, albeit low, but their combined admixture brings their European element to only 93.2% on average according to Lao et al(2010). However as one can see the 95% CI goes from 73.23% European to 98.08% European, probably many White Americans show a high European component because they are descendant of recent arrivals(i.e Irish Americans, Italian Americans), However those of Colonial stock, show to have more admixture, as the Lao et al(2010) study showed that some self identified Whites are only 73.23% European, which is pretty significant. The only difference between say a White American with a slight admixture and a White Cuban or White Argentine with no admixture, is that they White American might look more "White" because their European component is NW European, while the European component of a White Cuban or Argentine is Spanish or Italian, so the White American will fit in more in the American White community even though he is partially admixed.

Edited by Euskal kubatarrak, Dec 12 2010, 10:12 AM.
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Berserk
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Dec 12 2010, 10:00 AM
Berserk
Dec 12 2010, 09:36 AM
I didn't say that Sanchez was mixed. My point was that if you're living in America and you either look mixed with Indian or you have a Spanish last name most of the time you will be classified as non-white or partially non-white. For instance, many Americans see Cristina Aguilera as not being fully white even though she is probably 100% European, her mother is Irish and her father is Ecuadorian. Knowing where her father is from most Americans would assume that she has some Indian in her but her father looks 100% European so I doubt that's the case:


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Well that is kind of subjective I think, many people don't consider Cameron Diaz to be anything but White. Or Emilio Estevez, or Luis Alvarez. There are many people here too that claim Native American descent yet they are considered White, so it's sort of a double standard then. Anyways, it depends how the individuals identifies itself, for example Cameron Diaz, Emilio Estevez and Luis Alvarez don't identify with the Latin American community, yet Christina Aguilera does, and she even has songs in Spanish. So like I said it depends. I heard that Antonio Banderas was shocked when he first came to the US, and found out they did not consider him White. Also in the movie "Disaster Movie", they satirize the character played by Javier Barden in "No Country for old Man" as the "creepy Mexican dude", even though Barden is Spanish.
Anyways these people even though they carry Spanish surnames are usually thought as being White by the average americans.

Emilio Estevez
Posted Image

Luis Alvarez

Posted Image

Cameron Diaz(Who turns out has known Amerindian Ancestry via her American mom)

Posted Image

Joanna Garcia

Posted Image

Albio Sires

Posted Image


The last two are full blooded Cubans, but since they look like WASPs types, people usually don't see them as anything else than White. In your head though you are equating White to WASPs.

Anyways, my take on this was that White Americans as a whole are a mixed group, so the one drop rule did not keep them from mixing, also they carry SSA blood, albeit low, but their combined admixture brings their European element to only 93.2% on average according to Lao et al(2010). However as one can see the 95% CI goes from 73.23% European to 98.08% European, probably many White Americans show a high European component because they are descendant of recent arrivals(i.e Irish Americans, Italian Americans), However those of Colonial stock, show to have more admixture, as the Lao et al(2010) study showed that some self identified Whites are only 73.23% European, which is pretty significant. The only difference between say a White American with a slight admixture and a White Cuban or White Argentine with no admixture, is that they White American might look more "White" because their European component is NW European, while the European component of a White Cuban or Argentine is Spanish or Italian, so the White American will fit in more in the American White community even though he is partially admixed.


I thought Cameron Diaz got her admixture from her father since he looks kind of swarthy. Her mother looks fully white but I could be wrong:


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And yes, a big part of how Hispanic Whites are viewed in America has to do with how much they identify with that culture and how much they identify with the mainstream Anglo American culture. Emilio Estevez kept his last name but his brother and father changed theirs to Sheen so that they wouldn't be viewed as Hispanic actors in Hollywood but rather as WASPs. So, in that sense they are more "white" than Emilio even though they're from the same family because they try harder to fit in with the Anglos.


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Edited by Berserk, Dec 12 2010, 10:42 AM.
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Swans
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Nobody thinks Estevez and his family are non-white. Not even some. Basically if you're a darker pigmented Spaniard and have a Spanish name(like Banderas and Sanchez) then it's possible that you'll be classified as 'off-white' or 'other', but it's certainly not a rule.
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Euskal kubatarrak
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Berserk
Dec 12 2010, 10:29 AM
I thought Cameron Diaz got her admixture from her father since he looks kind of swarthy. Her mother looks fully white but I could be wrong:


Posted Image Posted Image Posted Image


And yes, a big part of how Hispanic Whites are viewed in America has to do with how much they identify with that culture and how much they identify with the mainstream Anglo American culture. Emilio Estevez kept his last name but his brother and father changed theirs to Sheen so that they wouldn't be viewed as Hispanic actors in Hollywood but rather as WASPs. So, in that sense they are more "white" than Emilio even though they're from the same family because they try harder to fit in with the Anglos.


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Actually Cameron Diaz paternal family is Spanish Cuban, look at this:

Quote:
 
Diaz was born in San Diego, California, the daughter of Billie (née Early), an import-export agent, and Emilio Diaz (1949–2008), who worked for the California oil company UNOCAL for more than 20 years as a field gauger.[1][2] Her father, who was born in Los Angeles County, was a second-generation Cuban American, whose family came from Spain via Cuba (her paternal grandparents settled in Tampa's Ybor City)[3] and her mother is of English, German, and Cherokee descent.[4][5][6]


http://www.urbancinefile.com.au/home/view.asp?a=594&s=interviews

So it all goes back to what I said(You are equating White=NW Euro)

"Anyways, my take on this was that White Americans as a whole are a mixed group, so the one drop rule did not keep them from mixing, also they carry SSA blood, albeit low, but their combined admixture brings their European element to only 93.2% on average according to Lao et al(2010). However as one can see the 95% CI goes from 73.23% European to 98.08% European, probably many White Americans show a high European component because they are descendant of recent arrivals(i.e Irish Americans, Italian Americans), However those of Colonial stock, show to have more admixture, as the Lao et al(2010) study showed that some self identified Whites are only 73.23% European, which is pretty significant. The only difference between say a White American with a slight admixture and a White Cuban or White Argentine with no admixture, is that they White American might look more "White" because their European component is NW European, while the European component of a White Cuban or Argentine is Spanish or Italian, so the White American will fit in more in the American White community even though he is partially admixed. "

Hence why you might think Cameron Diaz got her admixture from her Dad, because even though he is of Spanish descent, his European portion is Southern European, and you are seeing White as NW European, which is why her mom even though she claims to be mixed, and she could be mixed looks more "White"(In the WASPs sense of it) than her Dad, who turns out is a Cuban of 100% European(Spanish) ancestry.

Edited by Euskal kubatarrak, Dec 12 2010, 07:05 PM.
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luipp
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Dec 12 2010, 07:04 PM
Berserk
Dec 12 2010, 10:29 AM
I thought Cameron Diaz got her admixture from her father since he looks kind of swarthy. Her mother looks fully white but I could be wrong:


Posted Image Posted Image Posted Image


And yes, a big part of how Hispanic Whites are viewed in America has to do with how much they identify with that culture and how much they identify with the mainstream Anglo American culture. Emilio Estevez kept his last name but his brother and father changed theirs to Sheen so that they wouldn't be viewed as Hispanic actors in Hollywood but rather as WASPs. So, in that sense they are more "white" than Emilio even though they're from the same family because they try harder to fit in with the Anglos.


Posted Image Posted Image

Actually Cameron Diaz paternal family is Spanish Cuban, look at this:

Quote:
 
Diaz was born in San Diego, California, the daughter of Billie (née Early), an import-export agent, and Emilio Diaz (1949–2008), who worked for the California oil company UNOCAL for more than 20 years as a field gauger.[1][2] Her father, who was born in Los Angeles County, was a second-generation Cuban American, whose family came from Spain via Cuba (her paternal grandparents settled in Tampa's Ybor City)[3] and her mother is of English, German, and Cherokee descent.[4][5][6]


http://www.urbancinefile.com.au/home/view.asp?a=594&s=interviews

So it all goes back to what I said(You are equating White=NW Euro)

"Anyways, my take on this was that White Americans as a whole are a mixed group, so the one drop rule did not keep them from mixing, also they carry SSA blood, albeit low, but their combined admixture brings their European element to only 93.2% on average according to Lao et al(2010). However as one can see the 95% CI goes from 73.23% European to 98.08% European, probably many White Americans show a high European component because they are descendant of recent arrivals(i.e Irish Americans, Italian Americans), However those of Colonial stock, show to have more admixture, as the Lao et al(2010) study showed that some self identified Whites are only 73.23% European, which is pretty significant. The only difference between say a White American with a slight admixture and a White Cuban or White Argentine with no admixture, is that they White American might look more "White" because their European component is NW European, while the European component of a White Cuban or Argentine is Spanish or Italian, so the White American will fit in more in the American White community even though he is partially admixed. "

Hence why you might think Cameron Diaz got her admixture from her Dad, because even though he is of Spanish descent, his European portion is Southern European, and you are seeing White as NW European, which is why her mom even though she claims to be mixed, and she could be mixed looks more "White"(In the WASPs sense of it) than her Dad, who turns out is a Cuban of 100% European(Spanish) ancestry.

that her dad supposedly looks swarthy is something I have seen elsewhere too. Its a weird classification that has been doing the rounds. I only ever saw a bright red face.
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Martin Sheen is half Spanish and half Irish and he adopted a stage name "Sheen" from a Irish Catholic Bishop--so that is "WASP"(White Anglo-Saxon Protestant).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Martin_Sheen

Some non-Romance peoples also adopted Romance names to land jobs or to have a certain flair-- so that process works both ways as well.
Edited by Crimson Guard, Dec 12 2010, 07:46 PM.
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Dec 12 2010, 07:44 PM
Some non-Romance peoples also adopted Romance names to land jobs or to have a certain flair-- so that process works both ways as well.
Like Howard da Silva.

Quote:
 
Early life

He was born Howard Silverblatt in Cleveland, Ohio, the son of Benjamin and Bertha Silverblatt. His parents were both Yiddish speaking Jews born in Russia. He had a job as a steelworker before beginning his acting career on the stage. He changed his surname to the Portuguese Da Silva, despite not having any relationship with Portugal or Brazil. (The name is sometimes misspelled Howard De Silva)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Howard_Da_Silva

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Some others I can think of off hand would be like Greta Garbo, Paul Muni, Richardo Cortez, Portia De Rossi and Robert Stack(his family adopted some Italian name "Modini" to land Opera gigs).
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Margarita Cansino changed her name to Rita Hayworth. Most people don't know about her paternal Hispanic background, which I read was Mexican, according to some, and Spanish, according to others. Her mother was believed to be of Irish-American ancestry, but in this, as in other cases, nothing is set in stone.
Edited by Curious2know, Dec 12 2010, 11:28 PM.
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Some Polish silent movie actress changed her name to "Pola Negri":

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pola_Negri


During anti-Irish sentiment in either the UK or here in the states, some Angelized their names for better social mobility as well. Berserk is just using British/WASP as some sorta pinnacle of "Whiteness" in the (modern)USA. Even other groups like French also had it done either by themselves or by the immigration office.

Another real issue is that certain Hispanic's don't identify themselves as White but as "Hispanic" or "Latino" or "persons of Color"--usually they're leftist types or very non-Europid so they likely arent ignorant to their own backgrounds and may come from not very good neighborhoods. But to say that Hispanic man he posted would be considered "non-White" by the regular joe American is quite silly to say the least.
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