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Gastly
Topic Started: Feb 14 2009, 05:21 PM (1,055 Views)
Colloquy
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i miss addie ;_;

[STAT=Gastly,30/35/30/100/35/80,Ghost,Poision]092[/STAT]

[SET]
name: Standard
move 1: Shadow Ball
move 2: Sludge Bomb
move 3: Explosion
move 4: Energy Ball / Thunderbolt
item: Focus Sash / Life Orb
nature: Hasty
evs: 36 HP / 200 SpA / 200 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
<p>Gastly is a cool, versatile Pokemon that has a few advantages over it's fellow Ghost-type, Misdreavus. Shadow Ball and Sludge Bomb provide good coverage and STAB, hitting nearly everything neutral. Energy Ball handles Water-types, namely Chinchou, but Thunderbolt is an option if you fear Mantyke. Explosion lets you go out with a bang, OHKOing nearly everything in Little Cup even off a 10 Attack stat. Hypnosis can be used for taking out counters.</p>

[SET]
name: Choice
move 1: Shadow Ball
move 2: Sludge Bomb
move 3: Energy Ball
move 4: Explosion / Hypnosis / Thunderbolt
item: Choice Scarf / Choice Specs
nature: Rash / Modest
evs: 116 HP / 196 SpA / 196 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
<p>This set has a ton of options, you could make a set with any of them, but this normally is the best, coverage-wise. Shadow Ball and Sludge Bomb hit nearly everything. Thunderbolt and Energy Ball hit Water-types, Energy Ball hits Chinchou and Ground-types, while Thunderbolt hits Flying-types, too. Hypnosis is an option for a fast sleep, and Explosion lets you blow up on a counter. With a Choice Scarf, Rash Gastly hits 25 Speed, making this an effective revenge-killer.</p>

[SET]
name: Substitute + Hypnosis
move 1: Substitute
move 2: Hypnosis
move 3: Shadow Ball
move 4: Sludge Bomb
item: Leftovers
nature: Timid
evs: 116 HP / 196 SpA / 196 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
<p>This set is Gastly's best chance against a number of walls in the metagame. Substitute on the switch, then preceed to Hypnosis the Munchlax or Chinchou that comes in. You will most likely hit with the two chances you get, then, you can either whittle down the foe's health or switch to another sweeper. Shadow Ball and Sludge Bomb hit hard and are for great coverage.</p>

[SET]
name: SubSalac
move 1: Substitute
move 2: Shadow Ball
move 3: Hidden Power Fighting / Sludge Bomb
move 4: Explosion / Destiny Bond
item: Salac Berry
nature: Modest
evs: 36 HP / 40 Def / 200 SpA / 200 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
<p>Substitute down until you activate your Salac Berry, then proceed to attack at 25 Speed. The trick to using this is to come in on an immunity, then set up your Substitute and repeat, while attacking if possible. Shadow Ball and Hidden Power Fighting provide good coverage, hitting everything neutral, but if you don't feel like you need to hit Rock and Steel-types, Sludge Bomb is an option for a more powerful attack. Destiny Bond can take out a Rock or Steel-type thinking you can't touch them, making it great for when using Sludge Bomb. Explosion is great for going out with a bang.</p>

[Other Options]
<p>A status set with Will-O-Wisp, Hypnosis, and possibly Confuse Ray could work, but that's better left to bulkier Pokemon, and Gastly has better things to do. Hidden Power Fighting was left off most sets because it only hits 5 base power more, when super effective, than a neutral Sludge Bomb. Mean Look + Perish Song may seem cool, but that strategy doesn't really work in Little Cup. A physical Choice Band set could work, but Gastly is more useful revenge-killing or sweeping, not getting one surprise kill. Taunt can work on a leading set, for shutting down stat-up and status Pokemon.</p>

[EVs]
<p>For the Choice and Life Orb sets, just max out Special Attack and Speed with 200 EVs, and put the remaining in HP. The SubSalac set needs 36 HP and 40 Def so that you activate the Salac in 3 Substitutes. Another viable option is going Lonely, as that will ensure a OHKO on a Curse Munchlax with Explosion.</p>

[Opinion]
<p>Gastly is a great Ghost-type, but sadly outclassed by Misdreavus in most aspects. Luckily, it has a few options that make it different, like status moves and Explosion, which is always great in Little Cup. Aside from that, Gastly is a good sweeper that can come in on its many resistances and take down a few Pokemon or revenge-kill with its wide coverage.</p>

[Counters]
<p>If Gastly is locked into Shadow Ball, Munchlax can easily come in and Pursuit it to death. Munchlax walls most Gastly even if they aren't choiced, but watch out for a Lonely Explosion variant. Other than that, Gastly is hard to counter thanks to its versatility, but is incredibly weak to revenge-killers. Diglett and Houndour come to mind, as they can easily Pursuit it to death.</p>
Edited by Colloquy, May 3 2009, 07:44 PM.
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eric the espeon
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vader was here

mmm.. Gastly is complicated.
I would recommend this for the "stranded" set:
move 1: Shadow Ball
move 2: Explosion
move 3: Sludge Bomb / Thunderbolt
move 4: Hypnosis / Thunderbolt
(Maybe replace Tbolt with Energy Ball, what would Bolt hit harder than your other moves?)

HP Fight can go to OO, STAB Sludge Bomb hits for 135 BP only 5 less that SE HP Fight at 140 BP. Poison has decent neutral coverage against most of the things that resist Ghost (Normal, Dark).

Explosion is the main reason to use it over missey, so its a must on this set. Also Sash should be the main item, with LO as an option. Without 19 speed its hard to get a hit in and Sash helps with that.

Choice:
I think this moveset would be best:
move 1: Shadow Ball
move 2: Sludge Bomb
move 3: Explosion
move 4: Hypnosis / Thunderbolt / Energy Ball
(Maybe take out Tbolt)

And saying in Set Comments that you can use almost any combination of those moves and still be effective.

And for Salac too, take out HP Fight replace with Sludge Bomb.


Some log about this:
Code:
 

eric the espeon: LV? 
Lord Vader: ? 
eric the espeon: Whats your opinion on HP Fight Vs Sludge Bomb on gastly? 
Lord Vader: I prefer Sludge Bomb 
eric the espeon: HP Fight has only 5 more BP if it hits SE 
eric the espeon: I am suggesting Addie moves HP Fight to OO 
eric the espeon: on all sets 
Lord Vader: it hits whatsitsface... 
Lord Vader: Aron and Shieldon 
eric the espeon: Munchy? 
eric the espeon: oh 
brad55 has joined Doug's Create-A-Pokemon Server. 
eric the espeon: hmm 
darkchicken113 has joined Doug's Create-A-Pokemon Server. 
eric the espeon: A bit specialised though 
eric the espeon: with Krow gone ive not seen them around at all 
Lord Vader: Sludge Bomb is better imo 
eric the espeon: k 
Lord Vader: unresisted coverage isn't that good on Gastly 
eric the espeon: What about Tbolt and Energy Ball? 
eric the espeon: they both seem "meh" to me 
Lord Vader: Energy Ball is excellent 
eric the espeon: really? 
eric the espeon: for Chin? 
Lord Vader: TBolt is pretty overrated 
Lord Vader: and Hippo 
eric the espeon: mm 
eric the espeon: and the Water/Rocks or Ground/Rocks 
eric the espeon: I suppose 
HeYsUp: Munchlax is important to hit imo 
Lord Vader: Shadow Ball deals with them usually 
Lord Vader: Sludge Bomb hits Lax for 5 BP less 
eric the espeon: Sludge Bomb is almost as strong 
HeYsUp: True 
HeYsUp: and poison chance 
eric the espeon: and hits most other things better 
HeYsUp: HP fire for Steels? 
HeYsUp: Like Bronzor 
Lord Vader: no 
eric the espeon: Shadow Ball hit Bronzor 
Lord Vader: Gastly doesn't need to bother with steels 
TekkenStorm has joined Doug's Create-A-Pokemon Server. 
Lord Vader: I would just switch out 
HeYsUp: There is no pure steels i guess 
eric the espeon: nope 


More comments later.
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Colloquy
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i miss addie ;_;

Sorry for not answering sooner.

I'll certainly change it to be more "SB favored" after dinner.
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HeYsUp
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Hey, what's up?

You could add this set:

set name: Gastlead
move 1: Shadow Ball
move 2: Sludge Bomb
move 3: Taunt / Hypnosis
move 4: Explosion / Destiny Bond
item: Focus Sash
evs: 116 HP / 196 SpA / 196 Spe

This Gastly is designed to shut down opposing set up leads, and getting rid of a pokemon or two with it. Sludge Bomb for reasons Eric Stated. Probably remove Hypnosis because it accuracy is godawful. Mention its immune to Fake-Out leads so its sash wont be broken.


Another thing after you change HP fighting to Sludge Bomb, change the EVs to "evs: 116 HP / 196 SpA / 196 Spe", it gives the extra HP to non LO sets, maybe even LO sets.
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Colloquy
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i miss addie ;_;

Okay, everything is fixed, except a few things.

- On the SubSalac set, neutral coverage with everything is superior, as when you only have two moves, hitting everything with them is needed.

- HeYsUp's set is basically the LO set now that it has Focus Sash, so I'll add Taunt to the OO and mention it as a lead.

---

This is ready. I'd change it myself, but I want a bit of approval.
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eric the espeon
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vader was here

Also quite a few of my other suggestions have been missed, like Sash as the main option on the first set for example. And all of my suggested movesets..

As for Salac, the only things that you will now get walled by and would not before are the Rock/Steels. And they are not exactly common.

And I agree that the lead set is similar enough to Standard, but Standard needs sash..
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Vader
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GoldenKnight says hi

Lead Gastly sucks a little. Meowth Bites and then U-Turns to take no damage and leave you dead/with 1 HP.
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Dixie
 
I speak for everyone when I say I don't know how the hell you have become site staff :D

i agree
owner of #lc, #osm, #lcwifi, #lcwarstories, #lcmafia, #lcubers, #lcwc, #vader, #VARK, #kfc and best of all #fap
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eric the espeon
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vader was here

Not all Meowth have bite, and even those will not like taking a Sludge Bomb in the face unless they have a sash. Its not a stunning lead but its workable.

And "shutting down Stat Up and Status" is not the main point of lead taunters, its blocking SR.
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eric the espeon
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vader was here

Other than mentioning Hypnosis in Set Comments as an option over any move on the first set, I think its done.
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Colloquy
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i miss addie ;_;

Approved.

eric edit: I said it was ok in this case. Normally self approving is not good, but I had checked it over.
Edited by eric the espeon, Feb 27 2009, 10:42 PM.
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Dixie
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Back. Will see in the next week or so how much I can contribute.

where is SubHypnosis. IMO it is easily the best Gastly set, Gastly can come in on three resists and sub on the switch; anything that can threaten it with Sucker Punch is there nullified with either Shadow Ball or Hypnosis, any faster revenge killer dies to Shadow Ball/Tbolt almost all the time and any smaller wall e.g. Munchlax is Hypnosis'd and beaten down. You have a sub to protect you even if it awakes and Munchlax can only 3HKO with Pursuit which equates to 4 attempts to Hypnosis.

Ridiculously powerful set IMO, even when there was Murkrow in the metagame.
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Colloquy
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i miss addie ;_;

Updated with Substitute Hypnosis set.
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Vader
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GoldenKnight says hi

[SET]
name: SubSalac
move 1: Substitute
move 2: Shadow Ball
move 3: Hidden Power Fighting / Sludge Bomb
move 4: Explosion / Destiny Bond
item: Salac Berry
nature: Modest
evs: 36 HP / 40 Def / 200 SpA / 200 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
<p>Substitute down until you activate your Salac Berry, then proceed to attack at 25 Speed. The trick to using this is to come in on an immunity, then set up your Substitute and repeat, while attacking if possible. Shadow Ball and Hidden Power Fighting provide good coverage, hitting everything neutral, but if you don't feel like you need to hit Rock and Steel-types, Sludge Bomb is an option for a more powerful attack. Destiny Bond can take out a Rock or Steel-type thinking you can't touch them, making it great for when using Sludge Bomb. Explosion is great for going out with a bang.</p>
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Dixie
 
I speak for everyone when I say I don't know how the hell you have become site staff :D

i agree
owner of #lc, #osm, #lcwifi, #lcwarstories, #lcmafia, #lcubers, #lcwc, #vader, #VARK, #kfc and best of all #fap
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Seven Deadly Sins
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KD24 banned Tangela

Moved to Substandard Analysis Revamps.

The set comments, opinion, and counters sections are extremely sparse, and need to be expanded on. A PM has been sent to the OP.
Kannon
 
SDS, Ice resists Water. Ground doesn't resist Rock.
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Dixie
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Back. Will see in the next week or so how much I can contribute.

OK, comments. Personally, running +Speed on Gastly is a bit meh for me now, as there isn't much in the same speed tier as you and many things in the 17 speed region choose to run scarf or are rare. The extra power is one of the reasons to use it over Misdreavus. Perhaps talk about Gastly's luring qualities due to Explosion making it a good partner for say Houndour if you take out Lax.(fighting resist helps too).

This should be stressed in the first set, that you can run Modest more easily that Misdreavus and have STAB sludge bomb compared to Misdreavus' shadow ball. Change first set EVs to that of the SubHypnosis set as you've probably taken out HP Fighting and not taken account having 31 IVs.

Try to be more specific in general as well, like "Sludge Bomb and Shadow Ball hits almost everything" ---> "Together, Sludge Bomb and Shadow Ball are only resisted by Stunky, Shieldon and Aron" sounds like you are more knowledgeable and is much more useful to someone new to the metagame.

SubHypnosis set: Sub on the switch--->Hypnosis--->Attack with intact sub. If hypnosis hits, they can stay in and lose their initial switch in or they switch to a worse switch in and you can attack that and possibly break through it. Most common swtichin Munchlax can't 2HKO you, Sub on the switch + leftovers possibly gives you 3 chances at Hypnosis ==> 94% chance of hitting at least once.

Opinion: talk more about advantages and disadvantages with regards to Misdreavus including power, dual STAB, Hypnosis, Explosion, more resistances and cons of lack of bulkiness and speed.

Other Options: possible mention of Shadow Sneak/Sucker Punch to surprise Misdreavus (and other general priority use)

Counters: Stunky resists both STABs and can Sucker Punch and Pursuit which can checkmate you, Shieldon has good defences and resists both STABs and Misdreavus is also a common check with a faster Shadow Ball or Shadow Sneak.

Edited by Dixie, Jul 11 2009, 08:15 PM.
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