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Topic Started: Jan 13 2010, 08:36 PM (344 Views)
Weidleface
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Been pimpin' since pimpin's been pimpin', pimpin'!
http://ps3.ign.com/articles/106/1060139p1.html

Enjoy. :salut:
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TSL
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No daylight, I'm too weak to face it!
Yep. Looks like they took all of my rantings over the last 10yrs and turned them into a concise document. :lol:

Thanks for posting that. I enjoyed the read. I would like to add Random Encounters to that list. Although, games like Rogue Galaxy made them work, I'd like to see them go.

The point made about recycling stories got me to thinking. I'm starting to think that the Japanese think we are retarded and incapable of grasping concepts deeper than Cowboys and Indians. Given what our pop culture broadcasts 24/7 for the most part, I can see why. But, I don't think it's a mystery that games exist in Japan that break that stereotypical mold. What's left to wonder is why we don't get any of those games here.

Persona 3 FES was a wonderful example of a story that went a different route. It got ridiculously repetitive in gameplay, but the atmosphere in the game was dope! Unfortunately, we don't get many games like that.

And further, it's unfortunate that WRPG developers don't follow this advice either. Every cotton pickin title is about slaying dragons or honing dragon powers. Enough with the cotdam dragons, yo! :lol:
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nate
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Yeah, that article was retarded as hell. It wasn't "How to fix JRPGs" it was "WRPGs are better and we should just make those instead."
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TSL
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No daylight, I'm too weak to face it!
I didn't take it that way at all. I don't think WRPGs were brought to the forefront. The context focused mostly on JRPGs but contrasted them against certain things that WRPGs do happen to do right. There could have easily been an equally long list of issues for WRPGs.

And dealing with many of those issues would "fix" JRPGs for me in many ways.
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Weidleface
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Been pimpin' since pimpin's been pimpin', pimpin'!
nate
Jan 13 2010, 09:45 PM
Yeah, that article was retarded as hell. It wasn't "How to fix JRPGs" it was "WRPGs are better and we should just make those instead."
Yeah, I wrote up a long response over at PSU. That thing pissed me the hell off. :lol:

My favorite part was the whole "Save points? I want to be able to save whenever, wherever AND have the game do it for me occasionally just in case I forget!" thing.
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Weidleface
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Been pimpin' since pimpin's been pimpin', pimpin'!
TSL
Jan 13 2010, 10:21 PM
I didn't take it that way at all. I don't think WRPGs were brought to the forefront. The context focused mostly on JRPGs but contrasted them against certain things that WRPGs do happen to do right. There could have easily been an equally long list of issues for WRPGs.

And dealing with many of those issues would "fix" JRPGs for me in many ways.
The entire article was saying "Look at Fallout 3, it has X, Y, and Z. JRPGs suck because they aren't like Fallout 3." The dude was wanting to change everything that makes a JRPG different from a WRPG. If you don't like JRPGs, fine. But don't say the whole genre should become something else just because.
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TSL
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No daylight, I'm too weak to face it!
I think you guys are taking it as more extreme than it was intended. Partially because you are partial to JRPGs and may take some issues with people making criticisms about them. To me it just seemed as if he said,

"Some things about JRPG suck. These things are archaic."

"They could stand to learn something from some of the WRPGs who have gotten it right in these categories."

Neither of those statements are false to me. But they are not exclusive statements either. There are things that JRPG destroy WRPGs at. However, the article was focused on making JRPGs better. And yes, by emulating certain things that WRPGs have done, they could improve. But that's not taking sides. It's just focusing on one side for the purpose of THIS article. Assuming that his opinions are absolute without all the context would be presumptuous in this case.

Whackass 4hr sessions with no save points don't "make" an RPG a JRPG. They just make it whack as @#$% :lol:
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DarkCloudLives

The problem is that WRPGs have the same issues that JRPGs do.
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anito
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I've enjoyed all the RPGs I've played this generation... so yeah
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Ragnarok
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Everything, everything, EVERYTHING!
Did we not have this discussion about the same or similar article in the past? I'm having a case of deja vu here. :lol:
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TSL
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No daylight, I'm too weak to face it!
DarkCloudLives
Jan 14 2010, 01:23 AM
The problem is that WRPGs have the same issues that JRPGs do.
They have unique issues as well. I think anyone could just have easily told this story from the opposite perspective. I know I have a laundry list of issues with WRPGs just like I do with JRPGs. Both genres need to step up their game in the grand scheme.
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nate
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The problem isn't we're all porcupining out because we like JRPGs and they're being mean. The problem is they're calling things broken and in need of overhaul that we like. I don't tell them how to enjoy Shooter 4529029, so who are they to tell me that my battle system just isn't very fun to them and should be done away with?
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TSL
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No daylight, I'm too weak to face it!
nate
Jan 14 2010, 04:30 PM
The problem isn't we're all porcupining out because we like JRPGs and they're being mean. The problem is they're calling things broken and in need of overhaul that we like. I don't tell them how to enjoy Shooter 4529029, so who are they to tell me that my battle system just isn't very fun to them and should be done away with?
To ask that question may be drawing absolute conclusions without absolute context. I can see where he is coming from because I share some of his opinions.

For me, I would just like there to be options. A meshing of what I love about WRPGs AND what I love about JRPGs would be my dream come true. That's how I'm taking what he is saying. That said, objectively speaking, I don't believe ANYTHING should be done away with if there is a fanbase for it.

I am being presumptuous in assuming that the author probably feels the same. I doubt he would care if they made umpteen million remakes of Xenosaga as long as there was an option to play FF12 and P3FES for guys like me and him. Unfortunately, what we end up with most of the time from Japan is Lost Odyssey and Blue Dragon. If that were to be Japan's only answer to the future, they could keep it.

And some of what he said had merit. I can't imagine anyone enjoying having to play a dungeon for 4hrs without a save point. Save anywhere is great for folks that don't have hours to game at a time. Putting it into a JRPG wouldn't steal the soul of the genre. (just as an example)

But again, we are both speculating on the intent of the author, so suffice it to say that I understand and respect where you are coming from. 8)
Edited by TSL, Jan 14 2010, 04:51 PM.
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nate
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Blech. Editing out my response since I'm in a foul mood from something else going on and this is a sore subject with me to begin with. I don't want to be all bitter and pissed in my response when there's no real reason to.
Edited by nate, Jan 14 2010, 05:13 PM.
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TSL
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No daylight, I'm too weak to face it!
Gotcha. Nothing I'm writing is intended to offend or piss you guys off. I'm just saying that I didn't get the impression from the article that you guys seemed to. But who knows. Maybe the dude DID mean it the way you guys took it. I can't really know without talking to the author about the whole scope of his thoughts.

8)

That said.. More importantly, what's trubblin you man?
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