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All About Clones and Other Disliked Characters
Topic Started: Jul 31 2008, 02:11 PM (674 Views)
Jonno
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Jonno's Arguments and Comments About What Most People Have To Say Against Clones and Other Characters

CLONES
I want to know why everyone has a Phoenix Wright-level case against Toon Link. He is a clone, but I wouldn't say he should've been replaced. The dev team should've just went and gave him a unique moveset similar to the following:

Standard: Fire/Ice Arrows
Side: Skull Hammer
Up: Deku Leaf
Down: Bombchu
Final Smash: Ballad of Gales

The dev team should also have added in smaller details, like instead of holding the Master Sword, he could've had the Hourglass Sword, and instead of the Hyrulian Shield, he could've had the Mirror Shield.

And then there's the King of Evil, Ganondorf... He should be given a new moveset entirely except for his down aerial (Stomp) and perhaps his standard special as well (Warlock Punch).

CLONES.... BUT NOT
I hear a lot of people going, 'Ike has the same moveset as Roy' or 'There can't be two blue haired swordsman, cut Ike!' The truth is... Quote 1 is absolutely wrong, and Quote 2 is just ignorant and/or stupid.

Lucas is often bashed for his special moves looking like Ness's, and even having the same names. Just because they look and sound the same, does not mean that they ARE. Lucas plays entirely different then Ness does, and (this is what makes him a clone... but not) almost every one of his other attacks are very different.

Wolf should've been given a more StarFox: Assault heavy moveset with a DIFFERENT FINAL SMASH, but that's it. All of his other moves are unique.

Falco should've been cut and replaced with Krystal, even though I personally like him as a character. She could've had a lot of unique staff-magic based moves, even though Falco himself's non-standards are unique. If he was in the next Smash, which is still likely, I think he should be given some different special moves. The Arwing for a Final Smash, and replace his Side B with the Bazooka from Assault... That's what would make him a bit better.

Like everyone else in this category, people wrongly accuse Lucario of playing exactly like another character. Lucario is a replacement for the lackluster Mewtwo in Melee, but IS NOTHING LIKE HIM. Lucario is a floaty fighting Pokemon that, aside from Aura Sphere, has an absolutely completely different moveset from our old legendary friend. Even Aura Sphere is somewhat different, it has a shadow effect, which deals more knockback than Mewtwo's Shadow Ball, which oddly had a lightning effect, which makes opponents flinch, but doesn't send them too far. Another unique trait about Lucario is that, as the battle goes on and he takes more damage... He deals more damage too!

UNIQUE
Pit, I don't really see a problem with. Smashers, most of them being tournament-goers, say 'Hes too spammy, WAAAAH!!!!! Noobs think hes so cool but he's too spammy!!!!! WAAAH!!!!', and I can see how a few of his moves, particularly his standard ground and side smash attacks, can be spammy... But we just have to get over this. Noobs may spam certain moves, but a lot of other moves (Counter, Projectiles, and stuff like that) can send them flying either way. Pit is a unique retro character who Sakurai wanted to be in Smash since the beginning, so there is no way he's getting cut.

The arguments about R.O.B. are that he is not important enough, or that others should have been in over him. You want to know why R.O.B. is in? Go replay/play the Subspace Emissary and find out.
Edited by Jonno, Jul 31 2008, 02:42 PM.
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Spoon
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The Eating Implement of Smash

You bash on Falco as much as Red bashes on Toon Link ;) I like Falco, he was great in Melee and is still great in Brawl. He's still CHEAP!

I don't care about idiots who think Ike is the same as Roy, just forget them.

Lucario replaced Mewtwo but is nothing like him, agreed.

Toon Link could've had a different moveset yes, and Link be better... cuz I miss Melee Link :'(

And yes I hate Pit but not just because he's "spammy"... that can easily be gotten around. If someone mashes forward B, roll when you know they're about to do it, or walk the other way and hit them when they're that vulnerable. Arrows are incredibly easy to block, especially if they're attempting to shoot when they're standing a way in front of you and you're both grounded. Not as spammable as Fox's laser, but more versatile.

I hate Pit because of every one of his qualities. How noobs always flock right to him, his stupid bow-sword thing, his recovery (I do love gimping his UpB though, that makes my rainy day), the fact that EVERY one of his smash attacks can so easily be spammed, and due to the fact that combos can so easily be broken you'll find yourself hit in the fact with one of these out of nowhere. Plus, his aerials suck, they're weird, and I don't like playing or fighting this character.
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Jonno
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Spoon
Jul 31 2008, 02:34 PM
You bash on Falco as much as Red bashes on Toon Link ;)
But the difference is I'd still buy the game if Falco was in it or not. :P

Besides, I like the birdy, but I just don't think he is as important nor as popular as Krystal is to the serious is. Sure, he's Fox's second-in-command but still... Something feels off.
Edited by Jonno, Jul 31 2008, 02:38 PM.
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Spoon
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The Eating Implement of Smash

Oh come on, Falco is like Knuckles and Krystal is like Shadow. Knuckles has been around forever and is a classic favorite, and while Shadow is great you can't leave without Knuckles.

Well he said he wouldn't buy it if Pit was in ;)
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Jonno
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Spoon
Jul 31 2008, 02:39 PM
Oh come on, Falco is like Knuckles and Krystal is like Shadow. Knuckles has been around forever and is a classic favorite, and while Shadow is great you can't leave without Knuckles.
Opinions are what make the world go round, mate. XD
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Spoon
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The Eating Implement of Smash

Blehh. You're getting rid of Fox's brother who he's been with through thick and thin for a babe with a shiny stick. :P
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Jonno
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Spoon
Jul 31 2008, 02:41 PM
Blehh. You're getting rid of Fox's brother who he's been with through thick and thin for a babe with a shiny stick. :P
That last bit sounded a bit wrong. :P It's my opinion, and I'll even bring out the classic 'Smash needs more females even though its Smash Bros.' argument. :D
Edited by Jonno, Jul 31 2008, 02:44 PM.
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Spoon
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The Eating Implement of Smash

I trust you knew what I was implying. xD

Yea and I'm fully aware it's your opinion, or you wouldn't be saying it. =P
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Jonno
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Spoon
Jul 31 2008, 02:47 PM
I trust you knew what I was implying. xD

Yea and I'm fully aware it's your opinion, or you wouldn't be saying it. =P
I'm just saying, most people I know just don't like the way Falco plays. He just seems a bit weird, and no one really knows why. And yeah, I do know you were talking her actual fighting staff. XD
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Spoon
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The Eating Implement of Smash

Well are they big Fox players, or are they talking about his Melee to Brawl transition? Cuz being a big Falco player in Melee, I hated his new form, but that was before I got used to it. His aerials are so versatile, and he has the old bair (that poor Fox lost). His utilt I think is much better, at low percents you can combo it into another, plus his laser is easily the best of the three. His spike is harder and more frustrating to land, and his UpB STILL has no range at all, but his dthrow chains (muahahahahhaha) into an easy spike. He's also high on the tier list. I was really confused why at first.

Also, just throwing this out there, but his fair is evil when it comes to edgeguarding. There was a video titled "HOW TO USE FALCO'S FAIR", and it just showed him walking off the stage into an instant fair, where the opponent was stuck through the whole combo and thrown off far below and away from the stage. >:3
Edited by Spoon, Jul 31 2008, 02:54 PM.
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