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Canada drops Boeing F-18 buy, gets F-18 classics from Aussies instead
Topic Started: Dec 6 2017, 14:54 (264 Views)
Firestorm Control
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http://nationalpost.com/news/politics/canada-scraps-plan-to-buy-boeing-fighters-and-will-go-with-used-australian-jets-sources

Quote:
 
OTTAWA — Canada is scrapping a plan to buy 18 Boeing Super Hornet fighter jets amid a deepening dispute with the U.S. aerospace company, three sources familiar with the matter said on Tuesday.

Instead, the Liberal government will announce next week it intends to acquire a used fleet of older Australia F-18 jets, the same kind of plane Canada currently operates, said the sources, who asked not to be identified because of the sensitivity of the situation.

The move underlines Ottawa’s anger at a decision by Boeing to launch a trade challenge against Canadian planemaker Bombardier Inc., which the U.S. giant accuses of dumping airliners on the domestic American market.
It also casts into question the future of Boeing’s military sales in Canada. Boeing says its commercial and defence operations in Canada support more than 17,000 Canadian jobs.

Canada and Mexico are currently locked in increasingly acrimonious negotiations with the United States over the NAFTA trade pact, which President Donald Trump says has not done enough to protect U.S. jobs.

The Liberal government initially said in late 2016 that it wanted the Boeing jets as a stopgap measure until it could launch a competition for a permanent fleet to replace Canada’s aging CF-18 jets.

But as relations with Boeing deteriorated, Ottawa slammed the firm for not acting as a trusted partner and began looking at the Australian jets.

Two of the sources said Australian military officials had been in Ottawa late last month for talks.

One source said that by buying the Australian fleet, Canada would save money as well as avoid the need to train its pilots on a new aircraft or spend money on a new supply chain.

Officials had previously said that if the purchase went ahead, some of the Australian aircraft would be used for spare parts.

The offices of Public Works Minister Carla Qualtrough and Defence Minister Harjit Sajjan, who share responsibility for military procurement, both declined to comment.
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FSC Oceania
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Oh god why would you do that.
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Admiral Hanley
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FSC Oceania
Dec 7 2017, 07:26
Oh god why would you do that.
Basically because Boeing didn't want our new airliner flying in the US.
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Henry Dravot
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Admiral Hanley
Dec 9 2017, 16:34
FSC Oceania
Dec 7 2017, 07:26
Oh god why would you do that.
Basically because Boeing didn't want our new airliner flying in the US.
By selling them at almost half their production cost.
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Admiral Hanley
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Henry Dravot
Dec 9 2017, 18:48
Admiral Hanley
Dec 9 2017, 16:34
FSC Oceania
Dec 7 2017, 07:26
Oh god why would you do that.
Basically because Boeing didn't want our new airliner flying in the US.
By selling them at almost half their production cost.
Boeing does the exact same thing. MSRP is a fiction in the airliner industry.
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Sajjad Azam
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Sale of Australian Classic Hornets to Canada

Quote:
 
Minister for Defence, Senator the Hon Marise Payne, today announced the Government has agreed to the sale of 18 Royal Australian Air Force F/A-18 A/B Classic Hornets to the Government of Canada.

The offer follows an expression of interest from the Canadian Government received in September. The sale of the aircraft and associated spares remains subject to final negotiations and Country of Origin export approvals.

Defence plans to withdraw its fleet of F/A-18A/B Classic Hornets from service by 2022, which will be progressively replaced by the F-35A Joint Strike Fighter, Australia's new fifth-generation air combat capability.

Minister Payne spoke with her Canadian counterpart, Minister for National Defence Harjit Sajjan, to welcome the sale.

“Australia greatly values our longstanding and broad bilateral defence relationship with Canada, and this decision is another example of our close and strong partnership,” Minister Payne said.

“The aircraft will supplement Canada’s existing fleet as it develops and implements its plan to replace the Royal Canadian Air Force fighter jet fleet.

Transfer of the first two aircraft is expected to occur from the first half of 2019, in line with the current plan to transition to the Joint Strike Fighter.

Australia’s first two Joint Strike Fighters are expected to arrive in Australia at the end of 2018.

FSC Oceania
Dec 7 2017, 07:26
Oh god why would you do that.
Explained in this video.
Edited by Sajjad Azam, Dec 12 2017, 23:54.
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FSC Oceania
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Sajjad Azam
Dec 12 2017, 23:52
Sale of Australian Classic Hornets to Canada

Quote:
 
Minister for Defence, Senator the Hon Marise Payne, today announced the Government has agreed to the sale of 18 Royal Australian Air Force F/A-18 A/B Classic Hornets to the Government of Canada.

The offer follows an expression of interest from the Canadian Government received in September. The sale of the aircraft and associated spares remains subject to final negotiations and Country of Origin export approvals.

Defence plans to withdraw its fleet of F/A-18A/B Classic Hornets from service by 2022, which will be progressively replaced by the F-35A Joint Strike Fighter, Australia's new fifth-generation air combat capability.

Minister Payne spoke with her Canadian counterpart, Minister for National Defence Harjit Sajjan, to welcome the sale.

“Australia greatly values our longstanding and broad bilateral defence relationship with Canada, and this decision is another example of our close and strong partnership,” Minister Payne said.

“The aircraft will supplement Canada’s existing fleet as it develops and implements its plan to replace the Royal Canadian Air Force fighter jet fleet.

Transfer of the first two aircraft is expected to occur from the first half of 2019, in line with the current plan to transition to the Joint Strike Fighter.

Australia’s first two Joint Strike Fighters are expected to arrive in Australia at the end of 2018.

FSC Oceania
Dec 7 2017, 07:26
Oh god why would you do that.
Explained in this video.
I totally get the political motivation. But seriously. Why the fuck would you buy a 40 year old, wings legit flown off airframe.
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Admiral Hanley
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FSC Oceania
Dec 13 2017, 05:09
Sajjad Azam
Dec 12 2017, 23:52
Sale of Australian Classic Hornets to Canada

Quote:
 
Minister for Defence, Senator the Hon Marise Payne, today announced the Government has agreed to the sale of 18 Royal Australian Air Force F/A-18 A/B Classic Hornets to the Government of Canada.

The offer follows an expression of interest from the Canadian Government received in September. The sale of the aircraft and associated spares remains subject to final negotiations and Country of Origin export approvals.

Defence plans to withdraw its fleet of F/A-18A/B Classic Hornets from service by 2022, which will be progressively replaced by the F-35A Joint Strike Fighter, Australia's new fifth-generation air combat capability.

Minister Payne spoke with her Canadian counterpart, Minister for National Defence Harjit Sajjan, to welcome the sale.

“Australia greatly values our longstanding and broad bilateral defence relationship with Canada, and this decision is another example of our close and strong partnership,” Minister Payne said.

“The aircraft will supplement Canada’s existing fleet as it develops and implements its plan to replace the Royal Canadian Air Force fighter jet fleet.

Transfer of the first two aircraft is expected to occur from the first half of 2019, in line with the current plan to transition to the Joint Strike Fighter.

Australia’s first two Joint Strike Fighters are expected to arrive in Australia at the end of 2018.

FSC Oceania
Dec 7 2017, 07:26
Oh god why would you do that.
Explained in this video.
I totally get the political motivation. But seriously. Why the fuck would you buy a 40 year old, wings legit flown off airframe.
Posted Image
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Sajjad Azam
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Seriously though, wouldn't it make more sense to focus looking into the Rafale or the Eurofighter right now? I mean they just made a couple sales to the Middle East recently.
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Admiral Hanley
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Sajjad Azam
Dec 14 2017, 03:33
Seriously though, wouldn't it make more sense to focus looking into the Rafale or the Eurofighter right now? I mean they just made a couple sales to the Middle East recently.
We can't just buy a replacement immediately, we have to have a bid/acquisition process.

The Australian buy is a stop gap to try and keep some of our planes in the air.
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Sajjad Azam
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Granted, but I guess my question is how much longer does the government expect to be flying the F-18s? Which dovetails into my other question, how long do they expect procurement to take?
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Henry Dravot
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Boeing ‘Eligible Supplier’ In Canadian Fighter Contest
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LONDON—Boeing has been selected as one of the potential suppliers for Canada’s future fighter aircraft despite the fraught relationship that resulted from the U.S. airframer’s claims of price-dumping against Bombardier’s CSeries airliner.

Boeing is part of one of five bid groups to be approved by Canada’s Public Works and Government Services agency to be allowed to bid for the Future Fighter Capability Project (FFCP) launched in December that will go on to select a platform to replace the Royal Canadian Air Force’s fleet of CF-18 Hornet fighters.

Boeing will once again offer the F/A-18E/F Super Hornet through the U.S. Foreign Military Sales system. The Lockheed MartinF-35A will also be offered by the U.S. government through the same process. Meanwhile, France will offer the Dassault Rafale, and Sweden the Saab JAS-39E/F Gripen.

The UK will act as the bid government on behalf of the four-nation Eurofighter Typhoon.

Canada wants to buy 88 fighters to replace its CF-18s, but only the eligible suppliers listed will be invited to submit proposals in spring 2019. Contract award is expected in 2021 or 2022, with deliveries expected between 2025 and 2031.

In December Canada canceled plans for an interim purchase of Super Hornets in retaliation for the U.S. Commerce Department’s proposal to impose a 300% tariff on imports of Bombardier CSeries airliners after a complaint from Boeing. In January the U.S. International Trade Commission (ITC) voted unanimously against the tariff, saying Boeing’s business had not been harmed. Canada is now pursuing an interim purchase of F/A-18s from Australia, with the first jets due to be transferred in mid-2019.

In an emailed statement, Boeing said it would continue to evaluate its participation in the FFCP program and that the airframer “values Canada as a customer and supplier-partner” for its commercial and defense businesses.

“We continue to believe that the Super Hornet is the low-risk, low-cost approach and has all the advanced capabilities the Royal Canadian Air Force needs now and well into the future,” the company said.

On its website, the Public Works and Government Services agency says it can add additional suppliers to the list as it sees fit and can remove them if it believes there are issues that “may be injurious to Canada’s national security.”

The bids will be assessed on cost, technical requirements and economic benefits, with bidders expected to make investments in Canada equal to the contract’s value.
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Admiral Hanley
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EF2000 or Rafale would be neat choices, but the lingering legacy of the airbus affair will mean we go with a NA manufacturer unless EADS or Dassault sweeten the pot significantly.
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