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Tsubasa Soru
Topic Started: Jan 18 2013, 11:55 AM (512 Views)
Yuan
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Your best nightmare.
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Character: Ji-Gun Kang

Request: New Technique

Changes:

Techniques
Tsubasa Soru (Winged Soru) (29 = 28 Branched from Soru + 1)
Type: Support
Range: Self
Stats: -
Description: Having mastery of the six Rokushiki techniques, Ji-Gun has since improved upon some of them. Tsubasa Soru is a technique that takes the regular Soru and applies it to use in the air. Ji-Gun is able to fly thanks to wings he gains from the power of his Devil Fruit. In this technique, rather than kicking off the ground to propel himself a certain distance almost instantly, Ji-Gun beats his wings to create the propulsion, allowing him to use Soru in mid-air. The user may move to any location they could normally reach within a number of meters equal to the rank of this ability near-instantaneously. During this movement, they cannot be seen by anybody who's accuracy is less than double this technique's rank, appearing as a blurred streak to anybody who's accuracy is above that point. Additionally, the user cannot be hit by a targeted attack by anybody who's speed is lower than the user while the technique is active. May be used once a post, but not in the same post as a regular Soru.
Edited by Yuan, Jan 18 2013, 11:57 AM.

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Kunugi

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Darkhunter
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soru = legs

not gonna work

same logic as you can't branch a punch from a kick
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AngelMayLaugh
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Using Soru in the air is more of a custom Geppou thing. Or Geppou Soru hybrid or whatever you want to call it. My 4 cents.
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Yuan
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The legs house some of the most powerful muscles in the body. Why? Because they carry the weight of the body at all times. Even if you build the heck out of your arms, you are increasing your muscle mass which increases the weight on your legs. In other words, your legs will always be stronger than your arms. The leg muscles just develop very differently from the arms.

Wings, however, are incredibly similar to legs. In winged creatures, their wings house the most powerful muscles in the body. When flying, wings carry the full body weight, rather than the legs. So really, wings develop in a very similar way to legs. And the surface area of the wings provides enough resistance against open air to provide lift, so they should be very capable of launching one's self forward much like legs kicking off the ground.

Thats the logic. My other defense is that I talked to Yaksha about it a while before I even made this topic and he said it should work just fine.

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Kunugi

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Darkhunter
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No this is really dumb, and i'm going to have to go over Yak's head on this. Its completely redundant in the face of branch rules.
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Yuan
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Its not that ridiculous really. The muscle development for wings and legs are really quite similar. Besides, my wings aren't always transformed from my arms. In one of my transformation my wings sprout from my back, and my arms are quite separate. I think it is kind of ridiculous to say wing = arms always.

Next you'll be saying that you couldn't throw a rankyaku with wings because it says legs, when wings throwing blades of air is so common amongst anime culture that it borders on the cliche.

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Kunugi

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Darkhunter
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yes... I would say exactly that.
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Yuan
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I'm not arguing against the branching rules, but against your assertion that anything to do with wings is equivalent to dealing with arms.

Do you think that a man could fly simply from having his arms transform into the shape of wings? No. Without the proper muscle strength a man wouldn't be able to lift his own bodyweight. A man with especially high arm strength might be able to hover for a few moments, but arm strength is not capable of carrying the human body for any extended period of time. In order to achieve sustained flight the transformed wings must carry the muscle strength of legs, at least. Wings should bear a much stronger comparison to legs than to arms.

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Kunugi

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AngelMayLaugh
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Yuan, you're aware that the argument was that wings and legs are two very different things, no? Wings =/= legs, thus why this won't work. I may add that the technique won't branch because of that; Arguing any further? A waste of time, because it has nothing to do with the issue. You can't branch, wings are different from legs, that is the reason. Soru is clearly a leg-dependent technique.
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Darkhunter
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I want to make it clear here. You can not take a punching tech at rank 4 and branch it into a rank 8 kicking tech with a knockback effect.

Do you understand where i'm coming from now along with the other mods?
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Yuan
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And my argument is that it is nothing like branching a kicking technique into a punching technique or vise versa. I'm saying it is more like branching a kicking technique into, say, a kneeing technique.

And besides, Soru is not a kicking technique like Rankyaku (I suppose I can kind of understand where yall are coming from with that, even if I think it is splitting hairs). Soru is a propulsion technique where the user pushes off the ground with a tremendous burst of leg strength. My argument is that wings have at least equivalent strength compared to legs, and enough surface area to push off the air like a leg pushing off the ground. I believe that it should be quite possible.

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Kunugi

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Yuan
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I've requested an admin review on this topic from Glass. I don't mean any disrespect to Dark or AML. I simply feel strongly about this matter, and won't feel satisfied unless I exhaust all options. If the verdict is against me, then so be it, I will drop the issue.

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Kunugi

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GlasgowSmiley
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Bursting bubbles is all I do here.

Dark and AML are right on branching, on my phone now so no detailed explanation.

I will add that while 1 rank branches aren't illegal per say, it's technically not done. Ethics issue moreso.
AngelMayLaugh (6/9/14 8:25:03 PM): ICY BRINGING THE FIRE
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The Unspeakable
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Different limbs, different techniques. The similarities between legs and wings do not matter at all. No matter how similarly they function in theory, they are moved by different groups of muscles.

Techniques represent a skill, a specific action or set of actions you have learned to perform through theory and practice. Soru is the art of moving your legs so fast that you create bursts of speed that allow you to move about much more quickly. Your character might think to themselves "Hmm, my wings are a lot like legs, I wonder if I could do the same thing with them?" but that's just the theory. In practice, it's different.

For one, while legs and wings both bear the load of the character when in use, they do so differently. At rest, legs are still, simply supporting the weight of the character. While moving, the legs undergo a certain set of muscular contractions in a certain order to achieve "walking" or "running". Wings, for a character at rest, must constantly be moved in a very specific way to maintain lift. While moving, they are often much less active (for most species of birds), tending to beat a few times and then straighten out for gliding over distances. In a sense, they work in almost the opposite manner of legs.

All that aside, the simple fact remains that this is not a reasonable branch. The big hair guy, for instance, could use his life-return controlled hair as arms for shigan. By this site's standards, that's a new technique. Knowing how to perform shigan with your hands does not mean you know how to perform it with your hair, even if you have full control over it. You need a technique where you perform hair shigan; that can then be branched normally.

Finally, how different a technique is from it's base is determined by the difference in technique rank. Even if this sort of divergence were possible, it would take a much, much greater gap between root and branch technique ranks to justify. This is something that should be kept in mind going forward.

I really don't get how you thought this would be okay. This shenanigans couldn't have really come at a worse time.
Edited by The Unspeakable, Jan 23 2013, 10:47 AM.
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Yuan
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??? bad time? Shenanigans?

Is this a bad time for OPRP? I thought we were doing quite well? Also, I don't really feel it is fair to call this shenanigans. It was a legitimate request, and all I did was respectfully dispute my opinion on the matter. Don't really see how anything wrong was done here. Also, I thought it was okay because it made sense. There was plenty of logic to my position on the matter. There was logic to your side as well. In the end, I was voted down, and thus I drop the request, as promised.

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Kunugi

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Beli: 66,000,000 • Ship: Ice BreakerLocation: Red Line Rapids
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