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Topic Started: Mar 6 2010, 12:24 AM (1,140 Views)
Vara
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Kakarot
Hey there. This is your team discussion board. Use it to discuss your moves, ask questions (Pm's work too, but here is better so we GM's can yell at eachother for it..) and whatever else you feel the need to.
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Serpit
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So what will we be avenging?
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Avvil
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Weaver of Tales
The deaths of the people we slaughter.

Wait...
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Serpit
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I get it. We will avenge the fact that we were thrown in this cruel war which includes killing all those people by destroying the very foundation on which this war rests, which means killing all those people.
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Avvil
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Weaver of Tales
Excellent. I like it.
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T3hDreadnaught
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Avenging Biovolt, is what I'm thinking (Since your team is finalized, I'll leave that with you to figure out BOTH of your identities.)
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Serpit
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...Beyblade? Dear GOD.
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Serpit
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So I assume we'll get Tala and Wolborg?

If this is correct, we'd better have Iceberg Dimension as a Reality Marble or something =P
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Vara
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Kakarot
Yeah pretty much... lol
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T3hDreadnaught
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My money was already on these guys. Gratz on the speculations. You'll get to see everything when we release it so I'm not confirming any moves.
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Vara
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Kakarot
You guys have the ???? master, because I can't give away the fact that he's Tala >.<
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Serpit
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So yeah, Vara replied to my PM and said that the effect of the Graveyard can indeed be activated when we want it.
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Touphi
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Protagonist
Heard you wanted some visitors, Slerp.
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Serpit
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Herd u liek mudkipz, Toffee.
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Vara
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Kakarot
Greengravy has taken over control of Berserker.
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gravy
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Try hard, camp harder
Well, this is a little awkward. Since Avvil didn't answer my IM, I'll just put it here.

First off, I'm sorry that you wasted the 120 points on AGI rank up. Huntail ninja editted his move around 12AM. No clue why that was allowed.

Secondly, @Vara. I get full regen tomorrow, yes? I'm a bit rusty on War 10 rules.
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Supremezero
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There is no such thing as society.
Meanwhile, on Team Rider board...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s1TI63qJwQM
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Vara
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Kakarot
Fixed the issue with Blizzard not hitting the other team.
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Serpit
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I still don't understand how Rider's NP managed to activate after they were already gone >_>

The damage also seems to high, given the info we got from Gravy.

Just asking: Are you sure this was possible? Having Rider flee as well as using his NP - afterwards?
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Vara
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Kakarot
What had happened last night is entirely within the realm of possibility, I assure you.
Edited by Vara, Jun 12 2010, 11:35 AM.
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Supremezero
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There is no such thing as society.
I'm a nice guy, so I'll point out the parts of your move that are illegal. In case you're wondering why I know these, it's generally because I've ASKED them before (though not actually the first one; that's simply connected to another question. I'll accept the possibility of it being wrong, but that really wouldn't make any sense.). If you want confirmation from the GMs, feel free to ask. I'm just doing this so you have earlier warning.

If this is still not enough to kill Archer, we will use Spiral Power to increase Wolborg's AGI by ++++ for this turn and attack as often as possible again, following the same conditions as above.

Spiral power usage may be a free action, but the extra attacks are extensions of the original attack, so stopping in the middle isn't really valid.

If Archer dies while we still have attacks left, the target will be switched to Caster. In this case, all normal attacks are always physical in nature, but we will not use Spiral Power even if we fail to kill Caster.

If Caster dies as well, the next target is Seira, followed by Archer's master.


As mentioned above, the extra CQC attacks are extensions of the original attack. As such, you may not change your target mid attack, whether your target has died or not.

Should we face Brawler, Berserker will use Gravity Well before his normal attacks, but only if it counts as an attack of "higher rank than B" despite dealing only C ranked damage.

Not actually illegal, but I'll point it out anyway: It is higher rank than B. That's why it was given that rank but dealing less damage than it should in the first place, yknow?

If Caster summons familiars, our priority will be Kain > Goblin > Tonberry. However, we not necessarily attack them.

Also not technically illegal, but still: You don't get to choose tanking priority. The one responsible for the tanking does. You can set priority if you like... just don't expect it to be followed.

Aaaaand, that's all of them. Have fun~.
Edited by Supremezero, Jun 12 2010, 07:54 PM.
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Serpit
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Quote:
 

Spiral power usage may be a free action, but the extra attacks are extensions of the original attack, so stopping in the middle isn't really valid.


Really? It was a slightly different case, but Vara confirmed that yesterday... I could have had Tala and Berserker target the twins. Tala would then have hit Rider. If this hadn't been enough, Berserker could have attacked Rider as well. Then if that kills Rider, Tala could keep attacking the twins, and then have his extra attacks caulcated according to their AGI.

Quote:
 
As mentioned above, the extra CQC attacks are extensions of the original attack. As such, you may not change your target mid attack, whether your target has died or not.


This has always kinda confused me, but I thought it was valid. I wouldn't get more extra attacks due to Caster's presumably lower AGI, I think. But let's say we kill Archer with our first attack, but would have several extra attacks against both of them, I could still attack Caster. Again, I'm not sure. If it's illegal, so be it, there's no better alternative.

Quote:
 
Not actually illegal, but I'll point it out anyway: It is higher rank than B. That's why it was given that rank but dealing less damage than it should in the first place, yknow?


Just making sure =P
Quote:
 

Also not technically illegal, but still: You don't get to choose tanking priority. The one responsible for the tanking does. You can set priority if you like... just don't expect it to be followed.


Oh, I can't know the exact mechanics of their skill. There's also a reasonable chance they don't input any tanking priority. I just like to be prepared.
Edited by Serpit, Jun 12 2010, 08:28 PM.
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Supremezero
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Just randomly, the idea that they WOULDN'T specify their tanking order is a physical impossibility (Imaginary impossibility?). If you go back through the archives, you'll probably notice me mentioning to Regaro about the absurdity that is successive tanking: You can't have more than one thing tank for one individual thing. Thus, you have to have them tank in order, which naturally means they'll always designate an order.

This has always kinda confused me, but I thought it was valid. I wouldn't get more extra attacks due to Caster's presumably lower AGI, I think. But let's say we kill Archer with our first attack, but would have several extra attacks against both of them, I could still attack Caster. Again, I'm not sure. If it's illegal, so be it, there's no better alternative.

Sure. But two characters may have different agility, yeah? So you attacking one with crap agi gets you, say, 7 attacks, while if you attacked another, you would get, say, 2. So if you attacked the 7 attack target, hit them once... and then proceed to attack the 2 hit target 6 times. See the problem?

Incidentally, if tanking occurs, your agi will be calculated in regards to your intended target, not the tankers.
Edited by Supremezero, Jun 12 2010, 08:35 PM.
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Serpit
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Quote:
 
Sure. But two characters may have different agility, yeah? So you attacking one with crap agi gets you, say, 7 attacks, while if you attacked another, you would get, say, 2. So if you attacked the 7 attack target, hit them once... and then proceed to attack the 2 hit target 6 times. See the problem?


I know that. But let's assume I have 3 attacks against A and 5 against B.

Now I attack A, but kill him with the first attack. I could then use the other two against B, not 4.

If I attack B and kill him with 3 attacks, that would mean I can't attack A any longer.

At least that's how I think it works >_>

Quote:
 

Incidentally, if tanking occurs, your agi will be calculated in regards to your intended target, not the tankers.


Well, at least I know this is not the case for servants tanking for masters, so I assume it only refers to familiars tanking for servants (or masters).
Edited by Serpit, Jun 12 2010, 08:48 PM.
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Supremezero
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There is no such thing as society.
I know that. But let's assume I have 3 attacks against A and 5 against B.

Now I attack A, but kill him with the first attack. I could then use the other two against B, not 4.

If I attack B and kill him with 3 attacks, that would mean I can't attack A any longer.

At least that's how I think it works >_>


Isn't that just as ridiculous, though? After all, you're attacking a slower target, so naturally you should get more attacks, right?

... well, basically, it's a loop of logic eventually causing a black hole.
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Serpit
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It isn't. It basically just means that if you attack two targets of varying agility, you always get the lesser amount of attacks (unless you focus solely on the slower one).
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Supremezero
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There is no such thing as society.
Alternatively, you simply don't allow changing of target so that the issue is completely irrelevant, which is what they did here, yeah?
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Serpit
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God I hope not =P
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gravy
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Try hard, camp harder
Question regarding Berserker-

Can he screw the rules to Endlessly Enragement without the HP req.?
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Supremezero
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No. Huntail asked that before, remember?
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gravy
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Try hard, camp harder
No I don't remember. However, the HP requirement is still a requirement, so I'd like to have this cleared up.

Secondly...if two A+ reality marbles are used on the same turn, AGI is the deciding factor on which is used, right?
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Supremezero
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There is no such thing as society.
Quote:
 
Can we activate Endless Enragement with Screw the rules?

Questions:
No. Screw the Rules works for the activation of skills, and not abilities. Since Endless Enragement is not cast, you cannot screw its activation.


As for the second part, may I ask why you're interested?
Edited by Supremezero, Jun 14 2010, 10:30 PM.
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gravy
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Try hard, camp harder
I believe that Seira's RM was ranked A+. I forget. Just something to attempt to block.
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Supremezero
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There is no such thing as society.
Your memory is faulty.
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gravy
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Try hard, camp harder
I didn't save it so... I was just curious about this situation happening.
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Supremezero
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There is no such thing as society.
Incidentally, edits are on their way.
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gravy
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Try hard, camp harder
I heard.
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gravy
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Try hard, camp harder
First off...I lose 20% mana.

Second off...can I enter spirit form without a master? This may be somewhat suicidal but...well, I seem to be dead soon to begin with. Plus I guess I could hope for luck.
Edited by gravy, Jun 15 2010, 02:12 AM.
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gravy
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Try hard, camp harder
Also...at the tower, can i stay in spirit form indefinitely without mana burning there? the description says "masterless servants will not lose mana there".
Edited by gravy, Jun 15 2010, 05:10 AM.
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ssv9001
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Just killing time until the world ends.
I don't understand; why did Team Avenger flee without attacking? I can't get that result out of the conditionals.
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Serpit
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ssv9001
Jun 15 2010, 11:03 AM
I don't understand; why did Team Avenger flee without attacking? I can't get that result out of the conditionals.
Neither can I. Before the edit, we did in deed attack. I can only imagine that some weird ability prevented us from attacking, but that's not even the only thing that seems strange. There's a lot I have to ask Vara >_>

Also, even if we could not attack, we shouldn't have died from Markus' skill. That i'm pretty sure of.
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Vara
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Kakarot
Serpit, I'll be talking to you shortly, I'm sure, but first, I need to tell you that I went over each way I interpretted your rules. Then, I got two people to read it over as well (Zero and Touphi), and tell me what they were dead certain of the outcome being, and the conclusion we came to, is what happened.

It basically boiled down to: you were attempting to attack Archer. You started doing so, but Archer became untargettable due to spirit form. The rest of your moves and conditions revolved around Archer dying, or still living. This was my initial impression of your move, that I decided had to have been wrong, but, after getting more than my own opinion, I decided that this was correct, based on how your move is written and set.

Fixing your mana now, Zerker.

and yes, by staying at the tower, you will not lose any mana. Be it spirit form, or natural decay.
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ssv9001
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Just killing time until the world ends.
However, "Should Caster and Archer both disappear before the offensive phase and no other servants appear before the movement phase, we will leave the area as well and simply move to Temen Ni Gru."

This condition was not met, as Team Rider did appear. Therefore they should not have moved.

"If other teams appear before the movement phase, they will instead be targeted instead of the masters. The order of priority is Archer > Caster > Rider > Lancer > Assassin > Brawler > their respective masters > Ayana."

This condition was met. Even though Archer and Caster were not valid targets, the priority list was still given.
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Supremezero
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There is no such thing as society.
That conditional puts them on the priority list... under archer, who they couldn't move past.
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ssv9001
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Just killing time until the world ends.
Archer wasn't a valid target due to being in spirit form. Therefore it's clear he would be skipped over for priority.

In other words, that list is a priority for targets. And the way a priority list works is 'If the first option is valid, do it; otherwise, if the second option is valid, do it...'. This is entirely consistent with my interpretation.

And yours fails. Here, an example. Let's draw a priority list for my actions today. Hang out with friends > Go to Borders > Sit in my room on the computer. Since the first option was invalid (due to friends being busy), under your interpretation I would be 'stuck' on the first and unable to go to Borders. Does that really make sense to you?
Edited by ssv9001, Jun 15 2010, 07:03 PM.
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Supremezero
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There is no such thing as society.
But that's not what it SAID. It said to only move on if Archer died. That's the issue here.
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Vara
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Kakarot
ssv9001
Jun 15 2010, 06:56 PM
However, "Should Caster and Archer both disappear before the offensive phase and no other servants appear before the movement phase, we will leave the area as well and simply move to Temen Ni Gru."

This condition was not met, as Team Rider did appear. Therefore they should not have moved.
So you are right, Scep.
I apologize, Serpit and Avvil, I overlooked something so simple like this. I'll make the necessary changes.
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Vara
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Kakarot
As to skipping past Archer, Zero is correct. The next target was only to be selected upon his death. Nothing else.
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ssv9001
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Just killing time until the world ends.
Okay, how about this?

"If we are for some reason no longer in combat and have to use Let It Rip again, our main target will be Archer. If Archer is not available, we will follow the priority list posted below."

They left combat when Archer went into spirit form, right?
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Supremezero
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There is no such thing as society.
They did use let it rip, though.
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