Welcome Guest [Log In] [Register]
Add Reply
Discussions
Topic Started: Feb 16 2010, 07:17 PM (9,107 Views)
Cross_Blade
Member Avatar

Oh yeah, that's right, we can do an attack and summon Scarlet if necessary in one phase I think. Two rounds should also hurt too
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
guild525
Member Avatar

Summoning Scarlet is handy, we can now judge the strength of the stakes. I think punching Caster should come over Scarlet if we can do a massive amount of damage but the conditional to do it if Caster dies in one punch doesn't hurt.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Cross_Blade
Member Avatar

Hmm, good plan.

But yeah, I think next to Red Demon's and Derek's heals, Scarlet is the next best thing and then probably the Magic Cards
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
guild525
Member Avatar

Cross_Blade
Apr 20 2010, 08:35 PM
Hmm, good plan.

But yeah, I think next to Red Demon's and Derek's heals, Scarlet is the next best thing and then probably the Magic Cards
Magic Cards could have been more useful if this war didn't end up with two big alliances clashing against each other. Scarlet is extremely useful though :D.


And I got Assassin's Master's O.K. on the plan. He'll CS you and we'll mow down Caster. If Caster uses a CS though I suggest we switch targets to Avenger. Also, I suggest we have Rider tank for Scarlet since Scarlet can do decent damage and Scarlet will tank any physical attacks for Derek. I'm kind of worried that Avenger will be able to hit masters.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Cross_Blade
Member Avatar

Assassin's master still has CS's, huh....didn't know that. What CS will he use, Focus on Strength?

Can we target Avenger right now? I thought we were all stuck in Depletion Garden, unless you think it'll crumble this turn
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
guild525
Member Avatar

Cross_Blade
Apr 20 2010, 08:42 PM
Assassin's master still has CS's, huh....didn't know that. What CS will he use, Focus on Strength?

Can we target Avenger right now? I thought we were all stuck in Depletion Garden, unless you think it'll crumble this turn
Yep, Focus on Strength.


I think it will tbqh. No master is going to have mana to use a Reality Marble and still have +150 mana. I seriously doubt it even considering Sacchin's regeneration. If it does, it still isn't a problem for us though thankfully.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Cross_Blade
Member Avatar

Alright then, sounds good. If this goes according to plan, Caster won't even know what hit her
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
guild525
Member Avatar

I think they're bound to use some sort of CS. Don't know which, but I guess we'll see, eh?
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Cross_Blade
Member Avatar

The only one I think she'll use is "Focus on Endurance" while she eats a corpse, that's my prediction. Jack Atlas is known for his raw power.

EDIT: Should we ask if we can CQC along with Red Demon's standard attacks?
Edited by Cross_Blade, Apr 20 2010, 08:52 PM.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
guild525
Member Avatar

Yeah, probably. And if they waste a turn consuming a corpse, it'd be lulzy.

Edit: Assuming this Reality Marble ends this turn since we'll just switch our target to Avenger and finish Caster after their CS is gone.
Edited by guild525, Apr 20 2010, 08:54 PM.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Cross_Blade
Member Avatar

I think they will eat a corpse. Not only is it Caster but she's in Depletion Garden, thus pressuring her more. They might survive if they use a "Focus on Endurance" CS and next turn attempt to fire Eva's CS which I'll guess is a magical nuke in which case we have our own "Focus on Magical Defense" CS.

If they eat a corpse and do nothing.....then I have no idea what they were thinking.

EDIT: Yeah, that'd be funny if Avenger was trying to charge something and we come out with EX Strength and waste her (though I doubt we will in one turn)

EDIT 2: Would you say Avenger has top priority right now? That might be a good point unless Avenger and Eva are allied which I doubt sine if they are not, Eva's potential CS could wipe Avenger and her stakes easy or at least do a ton
Edited by Cross_Blade, Apr 20 2010, 08:58 PM.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
guild525
Member Avatar

We could actually. The stakes actually have low agility apparently, so it wouldn't be surprising if we could kill one in a turn and then damage the other minorly or majorly. I don't think anyone here has a realistic chance of winning here but us unless something screwy happens.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Cross_Blade
Member Avatar

So basically right now, no one can come close to EX agility then......which is a massive advantage in both damage and dodge for us.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
guild525
Member Avatar

Yep. I hope the next update is as great as this one for us. I have a doubt though that Avenger can actually revive. It might be stupid to blue them on this, but maybe I should...
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Cross_Blade
Member Avatar

If Avenger can't revive, doesn't that only leave 2 Stakes of Purgatory left......
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
guild525
Member Avatar

Yes, but if they can it leaves an unknown amount. And I'm worried that they actually can because of the series they come from and how they work in said series.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Cross_Blade
Member Avatar

Yeah, if they can revive, I'd assume there's 6 by now, assuming you can revive 1 each turn, which might cost them mana but.....that's still a problem since we can't trap or meteor them all at once. It might be wise to push a blue onto their revival with the basis being how it works in Umineko

EDIT: If there's only 2, we can flatten them probably
Edited by Cross_Blade, Apr 20 2010, 09:06 PM.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
guild525
Member Avatar

Yes, but I'm still worried about it. Also, I think there are only four Stakes that Avenger can summon.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Cross_Blade
Member Avatar

Wait 4?? I thought there were 7 of them. Then again, I haven't watched much of Umineko to know anything to can you enlighten me?
Edited by Cross_Blade, Apr 20 2010, 09:13 PM.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
guild525
Member Avatar

They evaded it. I think they are actually reviving. Looks like we're not in as good as a position we once thought.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
guild525
Member Avatar

Cross_Blade
Apr 20 2010, 09:13 PM
Wait 4?? I thought there were 7 of them. Then again, I haven't watched much of Umineko to know anything to can you enlighten me?
I'm not a Umineko fan either but they excluded Stakes shown in the war (Mammon) and maybe a few others? You actually might be right in it being 6..
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Cross_Blade
Member Avatar

4 I think we can take. 6 might be a bit difficult. I just wish I knew their relative strength. I don't think 1 of them is as strong as a servant. Maybe 4 of them would be. 6 would make about 1 1/2 servant strength but if we can one round 2 of them, that means basically a servant gets a free shot at us.

Alright, it's still fine. It's safe to say we are the strongest in the marble right now. And besides, if the Marble shatters, we have the option of running to Back Alley or Duel Stadium to load up on traps and mana. If both Avenger and Rider had full HP and mana, I'd say Rider could win. We still have Red Demon's so EX Agi is still ours. As Psi said once, EX Agi is no joke.

Well, the other alternative is that Caster nukes everyone next turn after eating a corpse. I doubt they have good defense and if Avenger's master hasn't been using CS's all game (no clue I'm just guessing), I'd say they can only CS one stake which is VERY beneficial to us.

Also, we have 2 "Give it Your All" CSs so Rider is pretty strong right now
Edited by Cross_Blade, Apr 20 2010, 09:21 PM.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
guild525
Member Avatar

CSing one stake might not be bad actually. CS a stake to EX strength and hit with the rest and you can easily do ~250ish damage. Enough to kill a servant at least. And apparently the Stakes can two-round with Ange's Time-Stop guaranteed. I'm really nervous about what's to come if Depletion Garden is to end.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
guild525
Member Avatar

I might try forcing the blues to see if they can confirm. I want a definite stance on this seeing as how wasting a CS isn't beneficial to us one bit. I'll try and see if Archer's Master will be willing to hurt the Avengers though. I hope he will..
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Cross_Blade
Member Avatar

But remember, the 250 damage is assuming they all hit. EX agility and flight and 2 "Give it Your All" CS should let us cut that down to 175 roughly I'd say. Plus like I said, unless Caster is allied with them, Caster can still "help" us without knowing it if it goes according to my plan.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
guild525
Member Avatar

It -might- be a better idea to absorb if they are all alive though. Assuming we can take multiple actions, double Red Dragon Archfiend and then hit might be a good idea.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Cross_Blade
Member Avatar

Just a thought, what do you think the chances are of Depletion Garden lasting 3 turns? I mean, don't Reality marbles crumble when the world tries to restore balance to normal?

EDIT: I thought we were doubling Red Demon's and hitting, unless I'm mistaken
Edited by Cross_Blade, Apr 20 2010, 09:30 PM.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
guild525
Member Avatar

Cross_Blade
Apr 20 2010, 09:29 PM
Just a thought, what do you think the chances are of Depletion Garden lasting 3 turns? I mean, don't Reality marbles crumble when the world tries to restore balance to normal?

EDIT: I thought we were doubling Red Demon's and hitting, unless I'm mistaken
High chances.


And no I mean SUMMON Red Dragon Archfiend twice and do double meteors.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Cross_Blade
Member Avatar

We don't have enough mana for that, do we?
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
guild525
Member Avatar

After absorbing we will though.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Cross_Blade
Member Avatar

Eh, I'm a bit against that actually because we have no guarantee the marble will crumble plus we still have Touma and Caster to deal with inside.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
guild525
Member Avatar

I don't think Touma is a problem with Melee CQC. Caster has been doing pithy damage and we're about to heal the damage you took to max this turn. And this is just a possibility IF the Stakes can indeed revive. Maybe they never actually died and regenerate in Spirit Form? In which case our target would probably be Ange Ushiromiya.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Cross_Blade
Member Avatar

"Naturally, the Stakes of Purgatory may be revived, just as any other servant may be, should a skill to revive them exist."

This is the red on GameFAQs. The only thing I'm suspicious of here is that the red really doesn't say anything. I mean a servant can be revived with a revive skill if a revive skill exists.....that's not news to me. He might he trying to hide the fact that he CAN'T revive.

Also, has there been solid evidence that revival is possible. Have you heard any news or anything on Umineko that says "I just revived the Stakes of Purgatory" or did the stakes die then somehow come back later or is there some hint that they can revive?

From a SRPG GM standpoint, a revive in a game like this (a warfare survival game) should either not exist or at least not come cheaply
Edited by Cross_Blade, Apr 20 2010, 09:42 PM.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
guild525
Member Avatar

Cross_Blade
Apr 20 2010, 09:39 PM
"Naturally, the Stakes of Purgatory may be revived, just as any other servant may be, should a skill to revive them exist."

This is the red on GameFAQs. The only thing I'm suspicious of here is that the red really doesn't say anything. I mean a servant can be revived with a revive skill if a revive skill exists.....that's not news to me. He might he trying to hide the fact that he CAN'T revive.

Also, has there been solid evidence that revival is possible. Have you heard any news or anything on Umineko that says "I just revived the Stakes of Purgatory" or did the stakes die then somehow come back later

From a SRPG GM standpoint, a revive in a game like this (a warfare survival game) should either not exist or at least not come cheaply
Yes, but he can also be trying to not confirm the fact he CAN revive by just his team. I'm a bit paranoid of this. However, I'll secede for now. It is indeed broken for the Stakes to be able to revive but if it was something like only one can be revived a turn and he used Berserker to stall, it wouldn't be surprising...
Edited by guild525, Apr 20 2010, 09:46 PM.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Cross_Blade
Member Avatar

Also, what do you think the chances are that the stakes can one round us right now? Because if they can't one round us, we can run (assuming the Marble crumbles)

EDIT: I don't know. Why bother trying to hide the fact that he can revive? Wouldn't it be a lot simpler to just say, yes I can revive.
Edited by Cross_Blade, Apr 20 2010, 09:47 PM.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
guild525
Member Avatar

Cross_Blade
Apr 20 2010, 09:46 PM
Also, what do you think the chances are that the stakes can one round us right now? Because if they can't one round us, we can run (assuming the Marble crumbles)
They did 200 damage to Lancer. It might actually be safer to use another Rank Up CS instead of something like EX strength. But EX strength helps a ton more in killing Caster fast. I'd say we're pretty safe though seeing as how Lancer didn't double CS boost back then and started becoming tankish later. They only hit us for 25.5 too so assuming the Stakes can magically do that much damage, I'd say we'd still live.


Edit: Meh, I guess I was uselessly worrying seeing as how if this Reality Marble ends this turn, we're safe as hell.
Edited by guild525, Apr 20 2010, 09:48 PM.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Cross_Blade
Member Avatar

Alright, if we can live one round, then my worries are A LOT less.

In a situation like this where the game can be decided in a few rounds. Having first attack is GODLY!! from my experience

Here's the breakdown of the situation in my opinion:

Assumptions:
- we use one CS this turn (from Gendo), thus Derek has one more to use. He has two but we need one for victory.
- Caster goes for a corpse

Marble doesn't crumble:
- Rider vs Caster (no one else matters)
- we own Caster and take out Touma after and eat Touma's corpse
- everyone else is irrelevant
- Caster survives one round and counters next turn with her Noble Phantasm. This forces us to use a "Focus on Magical Defense" CS
- after we fight Avenger

Marble crumbles:
- Rider vs Caster vs Avenger
- we hit Avenger and Avenger hits us
- next turn, Rider heals as much as possible and uses a "Focus on Magical Defense" CS in preparation for Eva's nuke
- Eva's nuke hits everyone but after she will have little mana and be out of the picture
- weakened Rider vs hopefully 4 Stakes
- we go first and take out 2 stakes and hopefully they won't take us out
- next turn we take out the stakes or Caster leaving the other alive

Marble crumbles version 2:
- Rider vs Caster vs Avenger
- we hit Avenger and Avenger hits us
- next turn, Rider heals as much as possible and uses a "Focus on Magical Defense" CS in preparation for Eva's nuke
- Eva's nuke hits everyone but after she will have little mana and be out of the picture
- we run leaving Eva to get killed by Avenger

Strong Points to Rider currently
- EX agi giving us first strike
- EX agi and flying and 2 "Give it your all CSs"= we're pretty strong in tanking and especially evasion since no one can come close to EX agi without a Command Spell
- free Scarlet every turn most likely
- we have 1 CS as our ace in the hole after this turn



EDIT: I have a feeling that Avenger's stats are crap and make up for it by having superior numbers.
Edited by Cross_Blade, Apr 20 2010, 09:59 PM.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
guild525
Member Avatar

Just a note, Touma might be a potential ally since Assassin's Master and Touma have been friendly toward each other for a bit. I don't know for sure though.

And I wouldn't take Eva nuking as a definite although there is a good chance of it. And it might actually be a better idea to instead of running if Eva nukes, use our own NP that very same turn and hope to kill all the Stakes.

It's possible the Stakes can move first by the way just by Ange's ability which might or might not be a problem. Also Scarlet tanking a Stake's hit might not be a bad idea to see exactly how much damage they can do. Scarlet -might- be able to wall the Stakes although there is no guarantee.

And I suggest we just kill Caster altogether honestly. I doubt the Stakes can kill us in one turn and if they do a massive amount, we'll just heal it up and run.

However, I agree with focusing on Avenger if the marble crumbles completely.

Edited by guild525, Apr 20 2010, 10:02 PM.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
guild525
Member Avatar

*Kill Caster after Avenger of course.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Cross_Blade
Member Avatar

Yeah, the biggest wild card right now is Eva to be honest since she could be a potential indirect ally. But out of Caster and Avenger, Avenger gets top priority on the hit list.

As for Touma, he might be our ally but so far, we can dodge a master's attack with quite high percentage so even if he's not with us, he's not a problem. Of course if he is, then that's all the better.

I doubt Caster can survive two rounds of Red Demon's to be honest since if we have 210 HP and she already took 60 from a meteor. That would be 150 HP to her and I don't think she healed so far and getting two rounded by physicals per turn (a Caster's weak point) probably would be lethal
Edited by Cross_Blade, Apr 20 2010, 10:07 PM.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
guild525
Member Avatar

Cross_Blade
Apr 20 2010, 10:07 PM
Yeah, the biggest wild card right now is Eva to be honest since she could be a potential indirect ally. But out of Caster and Avenger, Avenger gets top priority on the hit list.

As for Touma, he might be our ally but so far, we can dodge a master's attack with quite high percentage so even if he's not with us, he's not a problem. Of course if he is, then that's all the better.

I doubt Caster can survive two rounds of Red Demon's to be honest since if we have 210 HP and she already took 60 from a meteor. That would be 150 HP to her and I don't think she healed so far and getting two rounded by physicals per turn (a Caster's weak point) probably would be lethal
They also took a hit from Assassin on the turn Lelouch died. Anyway, Assassin gave us their damage and I calculated it since they posted their sheet. Eva's END is C+. Two hits from EX Strength will definitely kill her.

Edit: To be exact, they take 84.5 * 2. That's 169 + 60.7 they took and 26.5 from Assassin.

Over 240~ which I doubt they have.
Edited by guild525, Apr 20 2010, 10:11 PM.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
guild525
Member Avatar

What's with the two guests reading this topic...?

Edit: 1 now.
Edited by guild525, Apr 20 2010, 10:15 PM.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Cross_Blade
Member Avatar

Alright then. That's fair. For Derek, since he has a bunch of actions, after healing should he use Scalpel on Caster but the Ray to reduce Avenger's hit rate should the Marble crumble

EDIT: Does the marble crumble at the start of the turn, or the end of the turn?

EDIT 2: Alright so Caster should die as long as a "Focus on Endurance" CS isn't used.
Edited by Cross_Blade, Apr 20 2010, 10:18 PM.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
guild525
Member Avatar

Cross_Blade
Apr 20 2010, 10:16 PM
Alright then. That's fair. For Derek, since he has a bunch of actions, after healing should he use Scalpel on Caster but the Ray to reduce Avenger's hit rate should the Marble crumble

EDIT: Does the marble crumble at the start of the turn, or the end of the turn?

EDIT 2: Alright so Caster should die as long as a "Focus on Endurance" CS isn't used.
I'd hope the Reality Marble phase or upkeep but I'm not sure.

The ray might be a bad idea since I doubt the Avenger's will take damage from it considering they are magic. I'm thinking that if the stakes get mana burned, they all die.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Cross_Blade
Member Avatar

I just wanted a use of the Ray to reduce their Hit Rate. But perhaps a direct damage approach might be best. But mana burn should be that if one is mana burned, the others will be dead too.

Also, I think Avenger isn't at completely full power because there were 2 of them when the Marble was raised on Night 16. Next turn will be Night 19, so even if they can revive one of them per turn, that's 5 of them next turn. I also bet revival comes at a cost and might be their NP in which case it would cost some amount of mana to revive them.
Edited by Cross_Blade, Apr 20 2010, 10:28 PM.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
guild525
Member Avatar

They -might- have the potential of not dying until Ange is killed but there is no way to know for sure. Them not being at full power is a good point though. If they aren't at full power, things will become extremely good for us.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Cross_Blade
Member Avatar

Well, they might not die but they will be unable to act in some way after their HP hits 0 I bet. If Ange is ever open, I doubt she will last 1 turn against a double attack from Red Demon's (even with no EX strength) since Neuro almost didn't last 1 turn to Red Demon's and Ange doesn't strike me as someone who can take many shots if Neuro can't really.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
guild525
Member Avatar

Cross_Blade
Apr 20 2010, 10:37 PM
Well, they might not die but they will be unable to act in some way after their HP hits 0 I bet. If Ange is ever open, I doubt she will last 1 turn against a double attack from Red Demon's (even with no EX strength) since Neuro almost didn't last 1 turn to Red Demon's and Ange doesn't strike me as someone who can take many shots if Neuro can't really.
I agree. I just hope Avenger hasn't been screwing with us in that they cannot or can revive. Psiop could have easily made special exceptions for Avenger's team which would be extremely annoying..
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Cross_Blade
Member Avatar

Well, there is SOME way to get rid of the stakes for sure since when we arrived there we 2 of them and I heard something big happened there before we arrived so dropping their HP to 0 should somehow force them to be unable to act if not outright kill them
Edited by Cross_Blade, Apr 20 2010, 10:41 PM.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
guild525
Member Avatar

Yeah.

So to finalize our move, is Assassin's Master going to raise our Strength to EX or not? I don't think conditionals can be set for CSes so..

Edit: I recommend we do the raise anyway since we have CSes to spare. If not, at least the one rank CS boost.
Edited by guild525, Apr 20 2010, 10:45 PM.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
1 user reading this topic (1 Guest and 0 Anonymous)
Go to Next Page
« Previous Topic · War 7 - Rider · Next Topic »
Add Reply