look-up

Jul 2 2008, 10:05 AM

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refused to go along with the lie that you couldn't see stars in space.

There's a reason why many photos do not show bright stars in them.

Light.

Can you see starts during a bright clear sunny day from the surface?

WHy would you see starts from the other side of the atmosphere?

If you notice, you can only see stars from deep space or from the dark side of any solar satellite.

If earth orbit photos were taken from the night side, you'd see stars, but not the day side. The brightness of the reflection of sunlight off the earth is too bright to make out stars.

From the moon is similar. it is not very far from earth. the earth lights up the space-scape. If you were standing on the moon during a part of the terran day where there was no light reflected to the moon from earth, you'd see plenty of stars, so long as the moon's surface was not too brightly lit.

David C

Jul 3 2008, 08:43 AM

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I'm not going to discuss your personal issues with other forums any more, how many more times before it sinks in? Discussing actual evidence, fine.

These are not personal issues. This is evidence that Bad Astronomy is not a credible site that should be taken seriously when doing Apollo research. The real reason you refuse to address the issue I raised is that you're cornered and this is the only way to weasel out of answering

Please address this issue. It's an Apollo-related topic.

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Perhaps the biggest slip of the tongue was made by NASA Chief Dan Goldin when interviewed by UK TV journalist Sheena McDonald in 1994. He said that mankind cannot venture beyond Earth orbit, 250 miles into space, until they can find a way to overcome the dangers of cosmic radiation. He must have forgot that they supposedly sent 27 astronauts 250,000 miles outside Earth orbit 36 years earlier.

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two sets of radiation data
http://hey_223.tripod.com/bulldoglebeautaketooooo/id82.html

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http://ocii.com/~dpwozney/apollo5.htm
http://www.erichufschmid.net/MoreInfoForScienceChallenge.html
http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=9659&hl=apollo

Orac

Jul 4 2008, 07:34 AM

Sorry, stars can be viewed in full sunlight. Drop down a mine-shaft and then look back up, you will see stars directly overhead.

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Many of the larger Astro-Telescopes are also capable of seeing stars in daylight.

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In my opinion the validity of Apollo has absolutely nothing to do with you being banned from certain forums, that's my final word on the issue.

David C

Jul 5 2008, 03:57 AM

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In my opinion the validity of Apollo has absolutely nothing to do with you being banned from certain forums, that's my final word on the issue.

Please stop distorting the issue. I'm not talking about why I was banned. I'm talking about the fact that the moderator desperately closed this thread with a bogus reason.

http://www.bautforum.com/conspiracy-theories/48507-911-pentagon-39.html#post893592
(Read posts #1094 and #1123 to see that it was bogus.)

The moderator at Bad Astronomy lied. Bad Astronomy is one of the biggest pro-Apollo sites there is. Those same people who were posting on that thread argue that Apollo was real. Whether the Bad Astronomy site is a credible site which should be taken seriously is a serious Apollo-related issue as if there are sites on whose forums moderators and pro-Apollo posters tell blatant lies, it is circumstantial evidence that Apollo was a hoax as lying is not necessary if the truth is being defended.

I'm asking you for your opinion about an Apollo-related issue. Please stop ducking the issue and address it.

Tell us what you think of the fact that the moderator told a blatant lie and tell us whether you think that Bad Astronomy is a credible site that should be taken seriously.

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You've already had my final word on the issue. If you want to discuss other forums, find someone else to willing to play your game.

HeadLikeARock

Jul 4 2008, 03:32 PM

Orac

Jul 4 2008, 07:34 AM

Sorry, stars can be viewed in full sunlight. Drop down a mine-shaft and then look back up, you will see stars directly overhead.

I think this is an urban myth.

David C

Jul 5 2008, 04:30 AM

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You've already had my final word on the issue. If you want to discuss other forums, find someone else to willing to play your game.

You seem to be cornered. The evidence that Bad Astronomy is not a truth-seeking site but a government damage-control site is so clear that if you try to discredit it, you'll just look silly--that's why you refuse to address this issue.

You regular pro-Apollo posters from the Clavius forum can never adimit it when you're cornered. You just start to play games until the whole thing blows over and then continue as nothing happened.

If this were a debating hall, the audience would be laughing out loud at your responses. When I get some information that goes against what I believe, I realize I was wrong and change what I believe because I want what I believe to be what is real. I don't want to be one of those people who "Knows" what isn't so.

Please tell us what you think of the Bad Astronomy website and tell us what you think of the moderator's action. He told a blatant lie when he gave his reason for closing that thread.

Orac

Jul 5 2008, 06:48 AM

HeadLikeARock

Jul 4 2008, 03:32 PM

Orac

Jul 4 2008, 07:34 AM

Sorry, stars can be viewed in full sunlight. Drop down a mine-shaft and then look back up, you will see stars directly overhead.

I think this is an urban myth.

I live in an old mining area. Go deep enough and straight enough (1500 feet or so). A modern mine of this type would already have a wheel house over the top of the shaft. Once the atmospheric light has been absorbed by the sides of the shaft, any star in your direct line of view and of sufficient magnitude is visible. You are not going to get a night-tme panorama.

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Cornered? I'm trying AGAIN to steer the discussion towards actual evidence, rather than discussing what you think about other sites.

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If you want to discuss that, find someone who's interested.

David C

Jul 5 2008, 03:39 PM

You are ducking this issue because you can't try to discredit it without looking silly. You were ducking the issue on the moon thread too.

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I'll deal with the other issues but you've been ducking this for so long that I want to concentrate on it until you give a sincere answer.

Orac

Jul 4 2008, 07:34 AM

look-up

Jul 2 2008, 10:05 AM

Quote:

 

refused to go along with the lie that you couldn't see stars in space.

There's a reason why many photos do not show bright stars in them.

Light.

Can you see starts during a bright clear sunny day from the surface?

WHy would you see starts from the other side of the atmosphere?

If you notice, you can only see stars from deep space or from the dark side of any solar satellite.

If earth orbit photos were taken from the night side, you'd see stars, but not the day side. The brightness of the reflection of sunlight off the earth is too bright to make out stars.

From the moon is similar. it is not very far from earth. the earth lights up the space-scape. If you were standing on the moon during a part of the terran day where there was no light reflected to the moon from earth, you'd see plenty of stars, so long as the moon's surface was not too brightly lit.

Sorry, stars can be viewed in full sunlight. Drop down a mine-shaft and then look back up, you will see stars directly overhead.

Many of the larger Astro-Telescopes are also capable of seeing stars in daylight.

Admittedly for those who are lugging portable equipment around, light pollution is a much worse problem, and even the big labs have special rules about street lighting in the near vicinity for the purposes of clarity.

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David C., return the discussion to the Mars data and your reasons for thinking it is not correct. We don't need to base arguments on whether another sight is disinfo or being unfair to you or your theory.

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I addressed this issue way back in post number 14 of this thread. Basically, there is video footage available of parachutes being deployed at 120,000 feet on Earth (where the pressure is similar to that on Mars), for both the testing of the Phoenix parachute, and also for project Sunrise (this involved collaboration from institutes in Sweden, Spain, USA and Germany, in addition to NASA and NCAR).

Can you clarify what your position is on the parachute issue? Do you think parachutes can't work in the Martian atmosphere? If so, what evidence do you have to back the claim up? Being undecided is an acceptable position, but you need to balance that up with the Sunrise project. Do you also think that mission could be faked, since it also required the operation of a parachute in low pressure?

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Can you clarify exactly what your issue is with the image analysis from previous Mars missions?

David C

Jul 7 2008, 12:42 PM

I've already made it clear that I modified my opinion after having seen the evidence of the parachute tests. It seems plausible that if a parachute can't open at six hundred MPH in very low air pressure, it may be able to open at three thousand MPH. Those tests were fakable though. The downward view could have been distorted by a lens that increased the distance using the same principle of looking through binoculars backwards. All I can do is wait until I can ask an objective expert who can do the calculations.

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"Two hours after the first color image appeared on the monitors, a technician abruptly changed the image from the light-blue sky and Arizona-like landscape to a uniform orange-red sky and landscape [below]. Ron Levin looked in disbelief as the technician went from monitor to monitor making the change. Minutes later, Ron followed him, resetting the colors to their original appearance. Levin and Straat were interrupted when they heard someone being chastised.
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It was Ron Levin being chewed out by the Viking Project Director himself, James S. Martin, Jr. Gil Levin went immediately and asked, "What is going on?" Martin had caught Ron changing all the color monitors back to their original settings. He warned Ron that if he tried something like that again, he’d be thrown out of JPL for good. The Director then asked a TRW engineer assisting the Biology team, Ron Gilje, to follow Ron Levin around to every color monitor and change it back to the red landscape.

"What Gil Levin, Ron and Patricia Straat did not know (even to this writing) is that the order to change the colors came directly from the NASA Administrator himself, Dr. James Fletcher. Months later, Gil Levin sought out the JPL Viking Imaging Team technician who actually made the changes and asked why it was done. The technician responded that he had instructions from the Viking Imaging Team that the Mars sky and landscape should be red and went around to all the monitors ‘tweaking’ them to make it so. Gil Levin said, ‘The new settings showed the American flag (painted on the Landers – below as having purple stripes. The technician said that the Mars atmosphere made the flag appear that way."

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My position on the Mars missions is that I don't know whether they were faked or not and if it turns out they were real, I'll be happy about it.

This is from post #75.
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What's a layman to do when he sees information from both sides that he doesn't have the background to analyze? Simply believing the official version would be pretty simple-minded in view of the fact that they faked Apollo and that the government planned and carried out the 9/11 attacks and that the government lies about science and history and news on a regular basis.
http://s1.zetaboards.com/LooseChangeForums/single/?p=79239&t=51606
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