Welcome Guest [Log In] [Register]
Add Reply
Obama releases long form Birth Cert.; alrighty then.
Topic Started: Apr 27 2011, 08:08 AM (6,871 Views)
cks
Member Avatar

RighteousThug
Apr 28 2011, 08:27 PM
Truth Detector
Apr 28 2011, 07:49 PM
RighteousThug
Apr 28 2011, 07:42 PM
cks
Apr 28 2011, 05:46 PM
Unlike some, I never doubted Obama's citizenship credentials - his mother was an American citizen.

Which is not enough to convey citizenship at birth, cks, since his father was not a US citizen.

Mom didn't reside in the US long enough after her 14th birthday to convey citizenship to -0-, so his being born in the States was/is crucial.
At what age did she leave the country for Indonesia and when did she return?

I don't recall the exact details rt now, TD, but that was the gist of the problem.

US Immigration / Citizenship laws changed several times from the 30s to the 80s, and the requirements that the citizen parent having resided in the US for x consecutive(??) years with y of those years being after age 12, then 14, then 16, went through several iterations. -0- may have been born during the '10 years after age 16' era, and mom left the US at age 25 if memory serves. Stay gone 1 year after that and your child does not have US citizenship.

All those rules were only for parents of legitimate children born abroad, one parent being a US citizen, one being an alien.

Point being that being born overseas of one citizen parent is not a guarantee of US citizenship for anyone.

Then there are rules for the kids themselves for retaining citizenship, one of which is/was having lived in the US for the 5 years prior to their 18th birthday.
I do not think that you are correct on this issue. As long as one parent is a US citizen - that child is a US citizen. My niece was born in England. Her mother is a US citizen, her father British. She is considered a citizen of both the US and Britain - in fact, has two passports. Until she was sixteen, she lived overseas (first GB, then Japan, and then Germany).

Part of the whole anchor baby issue involves those children who are born in the US. By dint of their birth, they are considered US citizens even though neither parent is a US citizen, Obama was born in Hawaii - when he was born, Hawaii was a state. Therefore, he is a citizen by din of his mother and by the fact that he was born in Hawaii.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
LTC8K6
Member Avatar
Assistant to The Devil Himself
cks
Apr 29 2011, 05:08 PM
RighteousThug
Apr 28 2011, 08:27 PM
Truth Detector
Apr 28 2011, 07:49 PM
RighteousThug
Apr 28 2011, 07:42 PM
cks
Apr 28 2011, 05:46 PM
Unlike some, I never doubted Obama's citizenship credentials - his mother was an American citizen.

Which is not enough to convey citizenship at birth, cks, since his father was not a US citizen.

Mom didn't reside in the US long enough after her 14th birthday to convey citizenship to -0-, so his being born in the States was/is crucial.
At what age did she leave the country for Indonesia and when did she return?

I don't recall the exact details rt now, TD, but that was the gist of the problem.

US Immigration / Citizenship laws changed several times from the 30s to the 80s, and the requirements that the citizen parent having resided in the US for x consecutive(??) years with y of those years being after age 12, then 14, then 16, went through several iterations. -0- may have been born during the '10 years after age 16' era, and mom left the US at age 25 if memory serves. Stay gone 1 year after that and your child does not have US citizenship.

All those rules were only for parents of legitimate children born abroad, one parent being a US citizen, one being an alien.

Point being that being born overseas of one citizen parent is not a guarantee of US citizenship for anyone.

Then there are rules for the kids themselves for retaining citizenship, one of which is/was having lived in the US for the 5 years prior to their 18th birthday.
I do not think that you are correct on this issue. As long as one parent is a US citizen - that child is a US citizen. My niece was born in England. Her mother is a US citizen, her father British. She is considered a citizen of both the US and Britain - in fact, has two passports. Until she was sixteen, she lived overseas (first GB, then Japan, and then Germany).

Part of the whole anchor baby issue involves those children who are born in the US. By dint of their birth, they are considered US citizens even though neither parent is a US citizen, Obama was born in Hawaii - when he was born, Hawaii was a state. Therefore, he is a citizen by din of his mother and by the fact that he was born in Hawaii.
Is your niece a NBC though? Citizen is not enough.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
LTC8K6
Member Avatar
Assistant to The Devil Himself
http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=293113

More quirks, including a failure to list Obama as a son...
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
retiredLEO
Member Avatar

Hawaii detective charges: 'Birth certificate' a fraud


Claims phonies created by state in order to 'screw with birthers'

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted: May 08, 2011
5:48 pm Eastern


By Jerome R. Corsi
© 2011 WorldNetDaily






Editor's note: Jerome Corsi's "Where's the Birth Certificate? The Case That Barack Obama Is Not Eligible to Be President" is available today for immediate shipping, autographed by the author, exclusively by the WND Superstore.

HONOLULU, Hawaii – A private investigator claims employees of the state Department of Health forged three Hawaiian birth certificates for Barack Obama to "screw with birthers."

Takeyuki Irei told WND one document placed the birth at Kapiolani hospital, another at Queens Medical Center and a third in Kenya.

The 57-year-old detective, who has been a P.I. since the 1980s, said he was stunned when he discovered that the purported copy of Obama's original birth certificate released by the White House was more or less an exact image of one of the forgeries.

Jerome Corsi's new book, "Where's the Birth Certificate?," is now available for immediate shipping, autographed by the author, only from the WND Superstore.

Irei said he was provided a copy of the document indicating a Queens birthplace but ascribed no importance to it. He explained that he was focused on finding evidence that Obama was born in Kenya, which he thought would provide a financial windfall.



Read more: Hawaii detective charges: 'Birth certificate' a fraud http://www.wnd.com/?pageId=295369#ixzz1LrbrCbAd
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
kbp

retiredLEO
May 9 2011, 09:00 AM
Hawaii detective charges: 'Birth certificate' a fraud


Claims phonies created by state in order to 'screw with birthers'

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted: May 08, 2011
5:48 pm Eastern


By Jerome R. Corsi
© 2011 WorldNetDaily






Editor's note: Jerome Corsi's "Where's the Birth Certificate? The Case That Barack Obama Is Not Eligible to Be President" is available today for immediate shipping, autographed by the author, exclusively by the WND Superstore.

HONOLULU, Hawaii – A private investigator claims employees of the state Department of Health forged three Hawaiian birth certificates for Barack Obama to "screw with birthers."

Takeyuki Irei told WND one document placed the birth at Kapiolani hospital, another at Queens Medical Center and a third in Kenya.

The 57-year-old detective, who has been a P.I. since the 1980s, said he was stunned when he discovered that the purported copy of Obama's original birth certificate released by the White House was more or less an exact image of one of the forgeries.

Jerome Corsi's new book, "Where's the Birth Certificate?," is now available for immediate shipping, autographed by the author, only from the WND Superstore.

Irei said he was provided a copy of the document indicating a Queens birthplace but ascribed no importance to it. He explained that he was focused on finding evidence that Obama was born in Kenya, which he thought would provide a financial windfall.



Read more: Hawaii detective charges: 'Birth certificate' a fraud http://www.wnd.com/?pageId=295369#ixzz1LrbrCbAd
"...Irei said the initial documentation he obtained from the Department of Health employee was the birth certificate indicating Obama was born at Queens. The doctor was listed as John Ohtani, whom Irei remembered as the doctor who also had delivered his own son, Chad, in 1980.

WND confirmed that Ohtani practiced at Queens during the years in questions. He has since died.

Irei said he kept the copy of the Queens document on file until about two months ago when his office was being repainted. The folder holding the birth certificate was among some 20 boxes of old records that were destroyed in the cleanup.

"I thought the money would be in proving Obama was born in Kenya," he said.

"I wish I knew what I had, and I wish I kept it. We thought because the birth certificate we had was fake, it wasn't worth any money. I wish we knew what we had," he said.

"Whoever forged these birth certificates wanted to cover all angles," he said. "Even making a birth certificate that showed Obama was born in Kenya that was an obvious forgery. The grandmother's name was forged."

Irei said the question still remains, "Where was Obama born and who has his real birth certificate?""



The private detective's story here is based upon a record he does not have.
Online Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
LTC8K6
Member Avatar
Assistant to The Devil Himself
Quote:
 
The private detective's story here is based upon a record he does not have.


That pretty much applies to Zer0's story as well...
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
kbp

http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=292901



A link from LEO's post is more interesting than the PI story, to me anyway. At the very minimum the failed Senante Resolution, co-sponsored by Obama, shows that the `natural born Citizen' topic was raised in questioning McCain's eligibility to hold the office.

The rules soon changed, it became stupid to question Obama's eligibility based upon whether or not he is a 'natural born Citizen'.

The definition of such regarding parentage citizenship is wide open still, but I'm not aware of any case law that defines that particular phrase; 'natural born Citizen'.

The humor is that the Resolution which failed, that which Obama co-sponosored, would have disqualified him from holding the office.

I don't believe there can be any court ruling now that would disqualify him as a result of his parentage.
Online Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
LTC8K6
Member Avatar
Assistant to The Devil Himself
Quote:
 
I don't believe there can be any court ruling now that would disqualify him as a result of his parentage.


Assuming the BC we have been shown is legitimate...
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
kbp

LTC8K6
May 9 2011, 10:45 AM
Quote:
 
I don't believe there can be any court ruling now that would disqualify him as a result of his parentage.


Assuming the BC we have been shown is legitimate...
Even if he had been born in Kenya, which I doubt is true, his mother was a US citizen. I'm not aware of case law or any other law regarding "natural born Citizen" that would then disqualify him from office.

I think that is yet to be resolved ...but I like the headlines that motivate those who oppose Obama.
Online Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
LTC8K6
Member Avatar
Assistant to The Devil Himself
kbp
May 9 2011, 10:52 AM
LTC8K6
May 9 2011, 10:45 AM
Quote:
 
I don't believe there can be any court ruling now that would disqualify him as a result of his parentage.


Assuming the BC we have been shown is legitimate...
Even if he had been born in Kenya, which I doubt is true, his mother was a US citizen. I'm not aware of case law or any other law regarding "natural born Citizen" that would then disqualify him from office.

I think that is yet to be resolved ...but I like the headlines that motivate those who oppose Obama.
If the BC is not legit, then there is no documentation of his birth.

Also, if the BC is what was provided to those who checked on his eligibility, then those checks are invalid. Those officials who certified his eligibility would have to withdraw the certification as it was made with false documentation.

I suspect that few of the officials who were supposed to check on the eligibility of candidates did those checks in 2008. If they had, many of them would have spoken up and said they had seen documentation of Zer0's eligibility for office.

I don't recall anyone speaking up and saying "Yes, I checked on his eligibility, and proper documentation was provided to me." when the eligibility issue first came up.

Take my state, for instance. Does anyone in NC check to see if the candidates for POTUS are actually eligible to serve and can legally be put on the ballot? If they check, how do they check?

If they did check, why didn't they pipe up and say something?

Also, if Hawaii is not going to show birth info to anyone, how can you check?
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
kbp

I'm not sure how that alters anything for ballots he has been on or even those he will be on, as it relates to the "natural born" question, unless a state law requires that it be provided.

I also question what the benefit of the state asking would be IF (big "IF") it is not a state Obama must carry for re-election. For instance, he knows he will not get Kansas, so why bother being on the ballot there?

Of course any states that have passed some law for their electoral votes to represent the US popular vote could be lost by him also.
Edited by kbp, May 9 2011, 11:29 AM.
Online Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
LTC8K6
Member Avatar
Assistant to The Devil Himself
I'm not referring to any new state laws, though.

For the 2008 election, no one in say, Nevada, checked to see if Obama was a proper candidate, correct?
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
kbp

Probably correct, but I'm not sure what the process would be in any state. Evidently, based on the presumption that state laws are being worked on to make it necessary to demand verification of a candidate's qualification for office because no such authority exists at this time, it's a rather open-ended part of our Constitution that can't be enforced.

It seems like a legal definition for "natural born Citizen" would be necessary if any person or state wished to verify someone meets that requirement.

So, if a person did have a frabricated document and they did not want to violate any laws by presenting that document to a state agency or department, they might just skip being on the ballot of any states that required it.


ADD: It might be worth the effort for a state to enact such a law AND define "natural born Citizen" in that law. At least that might force the federal courts to address the question of how it is defined.
Edited by kbp, May 9 2011, 12:34 PM.
Online Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
retiredLEO
Member Avatar

Phil Berg, wants to know if this is really Obama's birth certificate?

http://obamacrimes.com/

Check out note at bottom.

Edited by retiredLEO, May 10 2011, 03:31 PM.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
LTC8K6
Member Avatar
Assistant to The Devil Himself
retiredLEO
May 10 2011, 03:31 PM
Phil Berg, wants to know if this is really Obama's birth certificate?

http://obamacrimes.com/

Check out note at bottom.

That one is a hoax.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
1 user reading this topic (1 Guest and 0 Anonymous)
Go to Next Page
« Previous Topic · LIESTOPPERS UNDERGROUND · Next Topic »
Add Reply