Welcome Guest [Log In] [Register]
Add Reply
Crystal Mangum Arrested Overnight - 4/3/11; Who didn't see this coming?
Topic Started: Apr 3 2011, 11:21 AM (27,938 Views)
Quasimodo

Are we to assume that Crystal was claiming rape, but that no one in the Mangum
family contacted the DA to tell him of that fact and request his help,

and that Nifong only learned of the case when he saw the NTO order on the xerox machine?

Nifong knew the family for years, and they trusted him, but he never spoke to her about the case,
nor to her family?


What judges handled the earlier case involving Mangum's uncle?

What judges handled her own earlier run-ins with the law?

She got off surprisingly light--was that because an ADA put in a good word for her?

Would a family which apparently took advantage of every conceivable government program
not have become involved with any of the programs with which Cy Gurney was familiar--especially
if her husband was associated with the family over a long period of time involving a legal case?

(just more unanswered questions)
Edited by Quasimodo, Apr 5 2011, 05:39 PM.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Quasimodo

Would a family which Nifong knew or which at least trusted him, not
have heard about the guardian ad litem programs?

Would Crystal's children have been involved with those or similar programs?

After she made her second gang-rape claim, it is inconceivable that someone
in the family, to include Mangum herself, phoned or spoke with the District Attorney--
whom they knew?

Is it conceivable that Cy Gurney, probably also knowing the family, spoke
with Mangum or the family about the children--or did so through intermediaries?

All those possible connections have to be investigated, before we conclude that
Nifong didn't know about the case until he spotted the NTO on a xerox machine.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Joan Foster

Quasimodo
Apr 5 2011, 05:32 PM
Quote:
 
4/28/06 - 0918

Called victim [Crystal Mangum] in reference to an earlier sexual assault that she reported at Creedmor police department. She stated that she was dating F_____ at the time. She stated that she had ran away from home on previous times and that she had been found hiding at F____'s house after the police came with a search warrant. She stated that she was used by F____ to sell drugs and take the money to him. She stated that when F____ was not there some men would come over, L____, A_____ and S_____. She stated that she would have sex with them when Floyd was not around. She stated later that the men paid F____ to come over and have sex with her. She stated that one day F_____ confronted the victim about the men that were coming over and having sex with her. She stated that she denied it to him and then he brought the three men to the house. She stated in front of her she asked them and they all said that they had been having sex with her. She stated that F____ grabbed her and they went into the bedroom where she stated three men Mr. F____, A____ and L____ “ran the train on her” she stated she was very scared . In her voice I could sense that she was becoming very emotional, she stated that she did tell some of her family members about it and that she went to Duke Hospital about a week after the incident. She stated that Mr. F____ stated to her that no one would believe her and she stated that she didn’t think anyone would believe her since she had already had sex with them before. She stated that F_____ was very abusive and stated that if she ever told he would find her and that she was very afraid of him at the time. She stated years later she met her husband Mr. McNiel who she confided with about the incident. She stated he urged her to go report the incident so that she could have some closure and that she wont keep it a secret. She stated she reported it to the Creedmor police who did an investigation. She stated that she was told by the investigators that it would be a long process and that at her young age it would be mentally and physically tough and very hard on her. They told her that all three of the men were currently in jail and that were going to be in jail for a significant time. The victim stated that Mr. F_____ had been in jail for pushing his grandmother down the stairs which killed her. [no evidence has been found of this supposed murder]

[AFAIK, the three accused were never in jail. So is this two more lies from Crystal? Does she find it that easy to lie and make up "facts" to suit her convenience?]


She stated that when she found out they were currently in jail, she thought she had closure due to the fact that she had let some one know what happened and that they were going to be in jail for a long time she felt satisfied and she did not pursue it further.

--Notes of Investigator Ben Himan on statement of Ms. Mangum about her earlier accusation of gang rape
Can you imagine the impact on the case in the early days if Crystal's own story...repeated here...of sexual promiscuity , drug use, running away at 14...had been INCLUDED in the media reports?

This does NOT portray the picture of a woman, only dancing to get her education...otherwise quiet, studious, a "good mother."

Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Quasimodo

And if she did have that kind of "friend" in the DA's office or
in the Guardian at litem program (which likely means someone who works
with and knows judges),

then she had plenty of people ready to go to bat for her within the system.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Joan Foster

Take Crystal's OWN words here..the disgusting lifestyle she EMBRACED at 14...TOLD BY HER in this document..yet Nifong supposedly took HER word...over 46 good kids and the "second dancer." HE COULD NOT have believed her. Unless Nifong is among the most inept lazy, incompetent attorney's ever to sit his pompous butt in the DA office (possible..but I think just a contributing factor)...he knew she had been troubled, addicted and promiscuous.

What scum of the earth he is.
Edited by Joan Foster, Apr 5 2011, 05:50 PM.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
cks
Member Avatar

Joan:

I think you are right about Nifong being the most incompetent lazy prosecutor. It would not surprise me to find that Cy Gurney plays a role somewhere in all of this.

Just a question. Gurney is his second wife. I wonder what happened in his first marriage for it to go south.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Mason
Member Avatar
Parts unknown
.
In my experience, asking questions in the courthouse and to people that have represented Crystal - or those charged (or potentially charged) with overseeing her in some way - two areas always brought hushing silence:

Her Income and Her children.

These are people willing to speak about her health problems, her hospital confinements, and her legal minefield, but don't ask about how she makes money and what type of checks she lives off. And don't ask about how she could raise those kids.

I suspect those kids equate to cash via SS disability and other local Social Services programs.

.

Online Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
retiredLEO
Member Avatar

cks
Apr 5 2011, 05:29 PM
TD - this is so true......but this begins at an early age. Children in school cannot be disciplined (I am not talking about spanking, I am just talking about having some sort of consequence - losing recess, sitting at lunch in silence, etc) when they misbehave becuase it would make them feel badly about themselves. They soon learn that anything goes. Hence you have outright chaos in a number of classrooms. This attitude pervades society. There is always an excuse for someone's bad behavior that excuses what he/she has done. It's the "my bad" syndrome.

It is the reason why I wake up at nights worried about where this nation is headed.
That taking away recess, or sitting at lunch reminds me of boot camp. We had screwed up drill one day and the drill instructor said, since you can't seem to get your act together, we will go back to the barracks and do nothing, most thought that was a good idea, because it was about 100 degrees on the drill field. When we got back to the barracks we did nothing, we had to stand at attention, in the barracks for three hours. Does anyone realize how long three hours are when you are standing at attention and staring at a wall?
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Quasimodo

Quote:
 
Saturday, June 13, 2009
Why Nifong Knew On Mar. 14

(snip)

In his testimony during the State Bar trial which resulted in his disbarment, Nifong testified he “discovered” the NTO just as Neff reported. Nifong estimated his Mar. 23 “discovery” occurred sometime around 4 pm.

But he had to know about the case before then.

Here’s why:

By the morning of Mar. 14 a lot of people in Trinity Park (TP) already knew police had been to the house at 610 N. Buchanan Blvd. and that something "had happened" there.

"Did you see the two police cars there? Do you know what happened? Are you on the listserv?"

Trinity Park residents include Duke administrators, faculty, medical center personnel and other University staffers. It's home to a number of Raleigh N&O staffers, attorneys and others with regular business at the Durham County courthouse a mile or so away where the Durham DA and his staff also have offices.

So there was buzzing on Mar. 14 not only in TP but at Duke, the courthouse, other places and on the Net.

The buzz grew on Mar. 15 and got louder still on Mar. 16 when six or seven DPD cruisers were parked outside the house for hours and DPD Sgt. Mark Gottlieb subsequently emailed on a TP listserv seeking information from anyone who could help with the "investigation."

On Mar. 18 the N&O ran a story of a reported rape at the house; it ran a second story concerning it on the 19th.

Both stories ran in a part of the N&O's "B" section where local crimes are regularly reported. Many people involved in the criminal justice system routinely check that part of the paper.

I'd think a DA, especially one running for office, would check that part of the paper daily unless the DA wanted to be in a position where a citizen could ask about a reported crime in his or her neighborhood and the DA didn't mind having to say, "Gee, I don't know a thing about it. Why don't you give the police a call?"

On Mar. 19th adults at churches in TP were talking about the "horrible crimes" in their Sunday School classes.

A friend who teaches one of those classes later told me when his class met, it ignored the lesson for the day and "got right to talking about the case." My friend said there were "a few cool heads but most people were on fire."

With about five minutes of class time left, the class realized it should at least give the lesson a glance and did so. It then adjourned for coffee and to meet people from the other classes and those just arriving for the 11 o'clock service.

Do you know what my friend told me happened then?

He learned that in all the other adult classes folks had done just what they'd done in his class.

"Everyone" went to work on Monday, Mar. 20, at DU, DUMC, the courthouse, etc. and had lunch on 9th Street, Whole Foods, etc. Talk, talk, and more talk.

It had been a week since the party. During that week Nifong and his wife, Cy Gurney, had been campaigning for his nomination as the Democratic Party's DA candidate in the November election.

While we do newspaper ads and some TV spots and interest group endorsements count for a lot, campaigning in Durham still involves plenty of "retail" work: getting friends to host "deserts" and invite the neighbors in to meet you; getting out to service and fraternal club luncheons to be introduced and shake some hands afterward; asking people what's on their minds and do they have anything they want to ask you.

But with all of that, Nifong, if we believe the "Holy crap" copier discovery story, knew absolutely nothing about the case on Mar. 20.

With his office only a mile from the house; with many supporters in TP; and getting out and about in the TP neighborhood and nearby as part of his campaign and talking regularly to "the courthouse crowd" he'd known for almost 30 years, he had no idea there was anything going on that would later be called "the Duke lacrosse case."

And if his wife, Cy Gurney, well connected to many in TP, active in his campaign, a "partner" of many Durham activists and "victim’s advocacy" groups, and herself a courthouse regular by virtue of heading up the Guardian ad Litem regional program knew about the case, then we have to believe she didn't tell her husband Mike, the DA.

It's unbelievable, isn't it?

And folks, I've only taken the narrative up to Monday, Mar. 20.

If you believe the copier "discovery" story, you still have to get to about 4 o'clock on Thursday, Mar. 23, before Nifong learns anything about the case.

(snip)

This from my Apr. 25, 2007 Nifong & The Copier Discovery. Be Careful post:

There’s one thing we can all be sure about: It’s greatly to both Saacks' and Nifong’s advantage to be able to say they never spoke about the NTO before 3/23/06.

If they didn’t speak about it, there’s no need to ask sticky questions such as:

Before seeking an unprecedented NTO to obtain DNA and mug and torso photos from 46 citizens based solely on their race and membership on a sports team, what did Durham’s District Attorney and its Chief Assistant District Attorney say to each other about the accuser’s failure to ID any of the alleged rapists?

Did they say to each other anything about police officers’ and the second dancer’s statements that the accuser’s story was a “crock?”

What did they say about hospital records from Duke and the accuser's many conflicting stories
?

Folks, there are other reasons why I think the falsehood was created.

(snip)

On the comment thread of the Jan. 11, 2007 post kbp, a fine Duke lacrosse commenter, notes correctly Nifong is the signatory on the request to DUMC for release of Mangum's medical records. That request was made before Mar. 23.

I did not mention the records release form in Nifong's Copier "Discovery" Is A False Story or in any other post in which I've challenged the veracity of Neff & Nifong's copier "discovery" stories because it's very possible Nifong did not actually sign the request form

In many offices what are viewed as routine request forms are signed by others on behalf of the person in whose name the request is made and who is not available at the time of the request.

Also, some officials who signatures are required on certain form requests and other documents sign blank copies in anticipation of the documents needing to be used in their absence.

Mind you, I'm not say Nifong didn't actually sign the request for Mangum's medical records. I'm just not sure he did.

But I am sure he knew about the Duke lacrosse case well before Mar. 23, 2006; and I hope you're sure too.


John
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Quasimodo

Quote:
 
Allison Haltom [secretary to the Trustees and therefore privy to whatever
was communicated to them about the case; Judge Beaty removed her as a defendant
in the suits]

represented Durham's Child Care Council in a funding request before the County Commissioners in 1999 :

http://www.co.durham.nc.us/departments/bocc/Minutes/1999/5-3-99-WS.pdf

(name misspelled as "Halton")

And her Duke retirement article notes :

"...her contributions on child care issues in Durham have been honored with several awards."

These are certainly worthy efforts, but I wonder if she might have crossed paths with Cy Gurney at some point?


possible connections... :

Nifong--Mangum family--Durham judges

Cy - Crystal and her children--Durham judges

Allison Haltom--Cy Gurney--Nifong (??)

Dan Blue--William Barber





Edited by Quasimodo, Apr 5 2011, 06:08 PM.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
retiredLEO
Member Avatar

cks
Apr 5 2011, 05:13 PM
Who will be next? Her father? Another boyfriend? Or will it be one of her children who will annoy her or get in the way of whatever she wants?

If she get out of jail maybe she will go after Jackie Wagstaff or Victoria Peterson, which may be a good thing, will it wake them up?
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Quasimodo

Quote:
 
Here are some of CY Gurney's friends [old facebook account] [hat tip: maggief]


Annette G. Montgomery

John Fitzpatrick

Duff Wilson

Steven Storch

Curtis Paul Gay

Ellen Ruina

Candy Clark

Regina Carver

Leslie Wickham Jr.

Lucy Zastrow

Kendra Montgomery-Blinn

[...]

Stormy Ellis


But of course Nifong didn't learn of the case until March 23 at the xerox machine; and he never spoke
to her or her family about the case for ten months; and they never contacted him;
and his wife never spoke to them (?) nor they to her, not even about her children (?)
and she was not receiving financial aid for her children (which either Cy or Haltom MIGHT
have known about)

but Mangum at least certainly had avenues to reach into the DA's office and the courthouse
long before she claimed for the second time to have been gang-raped.
Edited by Quasimodo, Apr 5 2011, 06:14 PM.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
~J~ is in Wonderland
Member Avatar
~J~ is in Wonderland
cks
Apr 5 2011, 05:55 PM
Joan:

I think you are right about Nifong being the most incompetent lazy prosecutor. It would not surprise me to find that Cy Gurney plays a role somewhere in all of this.

Just a question. Gurney is his second wife. I wonder what happened in his first marriage for it to go south.
You are correct she is his second wife. They have a son who is a pure gentleman ( I really mean that) and I admire his courage to withstand all of this.

He has a daughter Sarah, by his first wife.

Cy was married to a now Judge the first time.

Someone (reporter?)wrote a little about this at some point during the frame. iirc
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Joan Foster

retiredLEO
Apr 5 2011, 06:06 PM
cks
Apr 5 2011, 05:13 PM
Who will be next? Her father? Another boyfriend? Or will it be one of her children who will annoy her or get in the way of whatever she wants?

If she get out of jail maybe she will go after Jackie Wagstaff or Victoria Peterson, which may be a good thing, will it wake them up?
Oh, they are awake already. They know full well what Mangum is. The Black community has known from day 1. Remember the young reporter from NCCU who could not bring herself to report what the neighbors told her.

They lie because they hope still that she is useful to their purposes. Actually, I mind this now much less. Because they have now lied to the point that their racial solidarity and pimping of Crystal looks so dumb now.

They look dumb. Beyond dumb. Like stupid oozes out of them.

They are stigmatizing themselves beyond anything the Carpetbagger Jihad might be able to do with them.

Carry on, peeps.

Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Quasimodo

More from John in Carolina:

Quote:
 
Here are some things that would have added to the Mar. 14 courthouse “buzz” about Mangum:

The deputy she tried to run down, John Carroll, is still a Durham deputy. He’s sometimes assigned to security at the courthouse and is there at other times to testify.

So most regulars know Carroll as do a great many DPD officers; and among those groups, many also know Carroll as a friend and neighbor.

The attorney who represented Mangum in the car jacking and attempt to run down Carroll is Woody Vann.

Like his criminal defense attorney father Art Vann before him, Woody Vann is a courthouse regular who in Mar. 2006 was long-time friend of Mike Nifong’s. ( I don’t know anything about their current relationship)

But with all the buzzing about Mangum going on at the courthouse, none of it reached Nifong’s ears.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
1 user reading this topic (1 Guest and 0 Anonymous)
ZetaBoards - Free Forum Hosting
Create a free forum in seconds.
Learn More · Sign-up for Free
Go to Next Page
« Previous Topic · DUKE LACROSSE - Liestoppers · Next Topic »
Add Reply