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CRYSTAL MANGUM TRIAL; December 2010
Topic Started: Nov 29 2010, 12:59 PM (56,649 Views)
Mason
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LTC8K6
Dec 10 2010, 11:13 PM
No furniture and a portable kerosene heater?

Does she have no money? Spend it on pills?

Where are all of her friends?

Poor kids...
.
There was trash all over the place - making it hard to walk through.

No furniture, only one folding lawn chair.

Yes, that was my take when I heard that, that is not any environment for children.

It's funny Crystal always has money for some things. I understand her Hair is being done with the $250-300 treatment - and I was told she looked very smart in an expensive suit.

When she was on the Government dole before she got Breast Enhancement surgery.

I was told Crystal left the court as she pleased, entered the public seating area during breaks and was seen walking the halls, entering the bathroom etc. The quote I got was that no one with back problems walks like that. She has quite the spring in her step.

She is extremely manipulative. She uses the Race card, the Gender card, the Victim card, the Pregnant card, the class card, the injured card, and guess what? It works almost every damn time. She is very persistent.


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MikeZPU

LTC8K6
Dec 10 2010, 11:13 PM
No furniture and a portable kerosene heater?

Does she have no money? Spend it on pills?

Where are all of her friends?

Poor kids...
BUT this woman graduated WITH HONORS from NCCU with
a degree in criminal psychology???

The NC AG goes before the cameras and tells the world that
ALL of the evidence contradicted Mangum's stories (lies) AND
that her own stories were self-contradictory. He took the amazing
step of declaring the boys "innocent."

So, what do her handlers do? They put together a book and prop
her up in front of the cameras to publicly reiterate a thoroughly
proven lie AND, of course, in the process, she changes her story
again for the umpteenth time, publicly pushing the ludicrous broomstick story.

Who is going to hire a person like that?

This is what her handlers have done for her, relegating her to a life of squalor.


Edited by MikeZPU, Dec 11 2010, 02:03 AM.
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~J~ is in Wonderland
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sdsgo
Dec 10 2010, 11:30 PM
“The right to remain silent …”

Yes, once she was placed under arrest, Crystal had a right to remain silent, even if that put her own children in grave danger. As jurors, we would want to hear that she took responsibility for setting the fire and warned those in the house. But she had no affirmative duty to speak out, and we must respect her rights.

But what does that really mean? Simply this – as jurors, we must set the issue aside when reaching a verdict. Her decision not to speak neither helps her nor harms her. We must base our decision on the facts before us. After all, Crystal stands trial for willfully and maliciously setting fire to the inhabited dwelling of another – not failure to warn. Ms. Mangum went into that bathroom, put clothes in the tub, started a fire, walked out, closed the door behind her, and said nothing about it to anyone during the short time prior to her arrest.

Arson is a particularly hideous crime because it violates the victim’s fundamental right to be secure in their own home. Mani Dexter ignores Milton Walker’s rights when she questions Cpl. John Tyler’s decision to allow Walker back into the house. Walker did not force his way into the house yelling and screaming. No, he did just the opposite. Milton calmly knocked on the door and stood there, with no shirt, no shoes, and wet clothes in the middle of a cold February night. He waited patiently to be let into his own home. But Dexter would have us believe that twelve year veteran officer John Tyler should have known better than to let an obviously frozen man back into his own dwelling. She claims that Cpl. Taylor’s decision to respect Milton Walker’s rights gave Crystal, who was in no immediate danger whatsoever, a legitimate excuse to fly into a fit of rage. Fortunately, the law doesn’t work that way.

Crystal knew exactly what she was doing when she struck that match. She – not Taylor, nor Walker, nor her children – was responsible for the fire in the bathroom. Mani, tell us, why did Crystal close the bathroom door? It wasn’t to conceal the fire, was it?
Shorten this up a bit and send it to the HS (letter to the editor) -anyone willing??????
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chatham
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Walker did need to get back into the house to get some medications he had in his clothes bureau in the bedroom. Because the scene was a crime scene he was escorted by Tyler, after getting permission by I beleive the fire marshall, to enter the residence, to get his medications. The fire had already been put out and Tyler commented that everything was covered in smoke residue.
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The lawn chair referred to above must be the one Crusty sat in on the front porch to hold her press conference when she was put on house arrest. The usual suspects showed up for that one as well ready to help perpetuate the myth of Crystal.
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Quasimodo

Quote:
 
http://democracydurham.blogspot.com/

Saturday, December 11, 2010

Here's Why So Many Folks Hate Crystal

(snip)

Now, don’t get me wrong. If you are in some way related to those Lacrosse guys then you might be forgiven for overzealously jumping to their defense. Likewise, if you represent some other party who was harmed in the whole Lacrosse debacle – the Lacrosse coach for example – I’ll cut you a little slack. But what I don’t get is the rabid, frothing-at-the-mouth, demonizing of Crystal by nearly the entire white population of Durham, North Carolina, and the entire country.

The press has painted Crystal as a slut, a liar, a psychopath, a ghetto dwelling mooch sub-human.

[Somehow I must have missed where the press depicted her in such terms. . . ]


We can debate the merits of the Duke Lacrosse Rape Case until the cows come home. That isn’t my intent here. My intent is to try to fathom what it is about Crystal Mangum that so infuriates people. I have a theory but let me lay the groundwork first.

Let’s assume, for the sake of argument that Crystal is guilty of falsely accusing those Lacrosse guys. Let’s even say that she did it because she has some form of mental illness. Let’s even say she’s manipulating the legal system to some nefarious end and plans to make a fortune off her story.

I submit that the exact same actions by a white woman would not elicit such scorn and attacks as have been visited upon her to date. Here’s why:

The United States has a long and sordid history of race relations.

(snip)

I know that I will be misquoted and misunderstood for saying all this. I will say right now that I am a supporter of Crystal Mangum. You don’t have to be. Go ahead and believe what you want about the things that she did. But in your heart of hearts you know that it is wrong to attack her personally. And, you know in your heart of hearts that if she were white she wouldn’t have suffered nearly the abuse that she’s gotten simply because she’s black. You also know that when a white woman accuses a black man of raping her it is a completely different scenario. Even if that woman were proven to be wrong and the black man was wealthy (I’ll have to look up case of Pro ball players this might have happened to) the outcome would have been very different.

[ I know in my heart of hearts that if the lax players had been poor instead of rich; or if they had been black;
or if they had been transgendered; or if they had been some other minority--that the case against them wouldn't
have stood for five seconds.]


Now, go about your business but let’s not have any more of this racist rhetoric.
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kbp

Truth Detector
Dec 11 2010, 09:53 AM
The lawn chair referred to above must be the one Crusty sat in on the front porch to hold her press conference when she was put on house arrest. The usual suspects showed up for that one as well ready to help perpetuate the myth of Crystal.
:roflmao:

Hope it was insured!
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Quasimodo

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http://www.durhamwonderland.blogspot.com/

SATURDAY, DECEMBER 11, 2010

The Mangum Trial Continues


The first week of the Crystal Mangum trial (on charges of arson, injury to personal property, contributing to the delinquency of her three children, and resisting arrest) has concluded in Durham. The trial raises one obvious question: namely, what criteria the North Carolina children’s services department possibly could have used to keep Mangum’s three children in the same house with her, given that the record of the lacrosse case proved that she either was a monster, willing to lie and send innocent people to jail for decades, or a person so mentally disturbed that she believed her lies. It’s perfectly clear from the record of the trial that the children were not well-served by remaining in Mangum’s custody.

A few items:

(1) A courtroom observer passes on news that upon her arrest, Mangum (falsely) told officers that she was pregnant. She also, of course, lied to the officers about her identity.

(2) Mangum’s intriguing defense amounts to a version of entrapment: (a) that police officers, having received a desperate 911 call from one of Mangum’s children, should have trusted the assurances of this mentally imbalanced woman that everything was OK, and not entered the premises; and (b) that, having been arrested, Mangum had no obligation to inform police officers that she had set clothes on fire in the bathroom, even as her three children were in a nearby room.

(3) For those desiring a peek inside the pro-Mangum fantasy world, Steve Matherly is attending the trial. In a recent post, the People’s Alliance “activist” has taken a break from defending Mangum, and instead has launched into the character attacks on the lacrosse players that were so common from figures like Cathy Davidson and her Group of 88 comrades. Matherly made the mindboggling claim that the role of the lacrosse players in the lacrosse case is comparable to “the racist riots of the 1920s and 30s.”

Yes, because as any student of U.S. history knows, in the 1920s and 1930s, local prosecutors throughout the South were—like Mike Nifong in the lacrosse case—willing to violate myriad ethical procedures in order to imprison innocent white people, despite baseless charges from a local African-American woman.


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sdsgo

Looking back over this thread and the linked articles, it’s impossible to determine when in the sequence of events Crystal allegedly started the fire. What was the timeline?
We have a 911 call from Crystal’s oldest child, then Officer Thompson responding to the call and finding Crystal outside throwing property into the yard. Here the story jumps ahead to Officer Tyler’s arrival. He reports finding both Officer Thompson and Crystal picking up clothes scattered across the floor and throwing them into the bathroom tub. (No fire yet?)

Shortly thereafter, Tyler hears a knock at the door. The kids scream and retreat to their bedroom at the back of the duplex. Tyler opens the door and finds Walker shirtless and shoeless. Tyler asks, “Are you the other party?”, as he lets him into the house. Crystal sees him and goes bonkers. The police subdue her and place her under arrest. (Window of opportunity ends.)

Now just where in this sequence of events did Crystal light the fire? Did someone see her enter the bathroom alone? Did one of the officers see Crystal exit the bathroom and shut the bathroom door?

We could use a few more details. Please.
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chatham
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I did hear Tyler testify that he smelled something in the apt that smelled like something burning or funny smelling. This was after crystal was put in cuffs. He saw a slight haze in the apartment. He went into the bedroom where the kids were, thought maybe a candle was knocked over, saw the 3 kids all huddled together on the bed. There was less smell and haze in that bedroom. He searched further entering the other bedroom, saw no candles burning but saw more haze in the air and it smelled a lot worse and that is when he opened the bathroom door and shut it. He also testified that the kerosene heater was not on. (although he originally said under oath that the kerosene heater was ice cold, when being grilled by the defense he admitted that no where in his report did it say ice cold....only that it was not burning or lit. So it was at room temperature.) I am wondering if the fire was started by placing a burning candle in with the clothes in the tub since tyler kept testifying that he did not see any burning candles. I guess we will have to wait for the fire chiefs testimony to hear what caused the fire.

I would guess that Thonpson left the apartment and went outside and she left crystal alone in the bathroom and that is maybe when she lit the clothes. If crystal looked like she was cleaning up there would be no reason for tyler to hang around crystal in the bathroom. Remember walker was outside at that time. It was not seconds after cuffing crystal that Tyler smelled smoke and saw haze in the air. I believe he said he smelled something and that is when he thought crystal should have said something. Walker was sitting in a chair separated from a cuffed crystal at this time. I do not remember tyler saying that he saw crystal throwing walkers clothes into the bathroom tub. But it is hard to hear testimony and the lawyers questions in that room. The bathroom door was shut when tyler went to check the bathroom.
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~J~ is in Wonderland
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~J~ is in Wonderland
The first officer there, Thompson - testified that when she got to the residents home, CGM was out in the yard. There were things scattered about around the yard, including a vacuum cleaner.
CGM went back inside the house and Thompson followed her. CGM went in the back bedroom. After a scan of the house, Thompson went in the back bedroom where CGM was. She said, CGM was taking clothes out of the bedroom to the bathroom. Thompson observed CGM doing this several time.
Thompson, would ask CGM what the problem was and CGM would just ask her to leave. Thompson also checked on the kids during this time.

imo- CGM could have set the fire anytime Thompson left the room. I think she sat it after Thompson arrived. By the time Tyler enters, the fire is starting to build. or...she could have lit it before she went outside and it was just smothered by the clothes and finally caught fire.
So, Tyler would not have seen any of the CGM putting the clothes in the bathroom.

According to testimony, the apartment is only 500/600 sq.ft.
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sdsgo

Thanks ~J~,

Officer Thompson’s testimony was the most important testimony of the trial, and virtually no one in the media paid it much attention. Thanks for filling in the gaps.

Edited by sdsgo, Dec 12 2010, 07:43 PM.
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Mason
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This was passed on to me:

Tyler is in there for about three minutes, he assesses the situation quickly and listens to Officer Thompson with CGM briefly, then Milton comes to the door shaking, shivering, and teeth rattling. Tyler brings him in, opens the only chair in there and sits him down on the folding chair. Officer Thompson has CGM near or in the back bedroom - but the Cops are trying to be positioned where they can communicate with each other. Milton sits down on the chair as told and never moves. Officer Tyler tries to question him, but Crystal is screaming. Tyler looks back and sees CGM going over Officer Thompson, who is short - and Tyler goes to assist Officer Thompson, whom was being overpowered. Mangum turns to the wall and pins her hands up in her chest ala T-Rex and continually moves away from the officers. Tyler tells her that all she has to do is stop resisting and they can get everything over with. CGM fights like she's having a fit. Each officer tries to take an arm, but Crystal would not allow that either. She got back up against the wall in the first position and I think that's when they take her to the ground. Tyler shut the door to the kid's room before he started to struggle with her so the kids wouldn't witness anymore than they had to.

Tyler notes from his time back in the Adult bedroom initially where CGM and Officer Thompson were, that the Bathroom door in that Bedroom is wide open.

They get Crystal handcuffed on the floor eventually, in the hall outside of the Adult bedroom near the kid's bedroom entrance (everyone stated how small the apartment is), but when they catch their breath after the struggle, they see the haze and smell the fire. Tyler says standing right over Crystal that something is burning and he says I'm going to see where it's coming from.

In searching for the fire, Tyler finds that Bathroom door closed now and opens it. He sees a good campfire size/type fire in the bathtub, but then's there's a flash and the bathroom ignites and flames roll out that door and roll along the ceiling of the bedroom. He quickly shuts the door.


Edited by Mason, Dec 12 2010, 09:08 PM.
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Mason
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Mason
Dec 12 2010, 09:00 PM
.
This was passed on to me:

Tyler is in there for about three minutes, he assesses the situation quickly and listens to Officer Thompson with CGM briefly, then Milton comes to the door shaking, shivering, and teeth rattling. Tyler brings him in, opens the only chair in there and sits him down on the folding chair. Officer Thompson has CGM near or in the back bedroom - but the Cops are trying to be positioned where they can communicate with each other. Milton sits down on the chair as told and never moves. Officer Tyler tries to question him, but Crystal is screaming. Tyler looks back and sees CGM going over Officer Thompson, who is short - and Tyler goes to assist Officer Thompson, whom was being overpowered. Mangum turns to the wall and pins her hands up in her chest ala T-Rex and continually moves away from the officers. Tyler tells her that all she has to do is stop resisting and they can get everything over with. CGM fights like she's having a fit. Each officer tries to take an arm, but Crystal would not allow that either. She got back up against the wall in the first position and I think that's when they take her to the ground. Tyler shut the door to the kid's room before he started to struggle with her so the kids wouldn't witness anymore than they had to.

Tyler notes from his time back in the Adult bedroom initially where CGM and Officer Thompson were, that the Bathroom door in that Bedroom is wide open.

They get Crystal handcuffed on the floor eventually, in the hall outside of the Adult bedroom near the kid's bedroom entrance (everyone stated how small the apartment is), but when they catch their breath after the struggle, they see the haze and smell the fire. Tyler says standing right over Crystal that something is burning and he says I'm going to see where it's coming from.

In searching for the fire, Tyler finds that Bathroom door closed now and opens it. He sees a good campfire size/type fire in the bathtub, but then's there's a flash and the bathroom ignites and flames roll out that door and roll along the ceiling of the bedroom. He quickly shuts the door.


.
If reading that, it seems Crystal may have been trying to prevent Milton from telling Officer Tyler what occurred there that night.

He had asked a question of Milton, we were told that he wasn't allowed to testify as to Milton's response, but Crystal was going over Officer Thompson at that point anyway.

Crystal had given a fake name and told the Cops from the get-go she wanted them to leave, so you know she didn't want them getting information from Milton.

.


Edited by Mason, Dec 12 2010, 09:12 PM.
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chatham
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So who started the fire? The kids?? Seems to me there was no time for crystal to start the fire unless she did it before the cops got there. Wouldn't they see smoke or flames if the fire was already smoldering or burning? Who closed the bathroom door?

IMO, something is missing here.
Edited by chatham, Dec 12 2010, 09:59 PM.
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