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| Mhuahaha's brain snacks; To test knowledge and general wit in LA. | |
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| Topic Started: Feb 1 2009, 07:59 PM (1,803 Views) | |
| ReidE96 | May 19 2009, 09:12 PM Post #221 |
Mr. Romance
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You point at freedom and ask if it would give you freedom. He goes "No". You take the knife box and die. |
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| Burn Jack | May 19 2009, 09:15 PM Post #222 |
Steward
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That's not what I'm asking. I'm asking whether he would tell me that this box would grant me freedom. |
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| ReidE96 | May 19 2009, 09:28 PM Post #223 |
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Mr. Romance
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"Would you tell me it gives me freedom?" "Yes" (he is lying, and it doesn't give you freedom) Edit: I can't seem to shake the feeling that we're missing each other here. Edited by ReidE96, May 19 2009, 09:29 PM.
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| Burn Jack | May 19 2009, 11:39 PM Post #224 |
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"Would you tell me it gives me freedom?" "Yes." He is lying — he would tell me it doesn't give freedom. But he is lying so it does give freedom. He is telling the truth — he would tell me it does give freedom. He is telling the truth so it does give freedom. "Would you tell me it gives me freedom?" "No." He is lying — he would tell me it does give me freedom. But he is lying so it doesn't give freedom. He is telling the truth — he would tell me it doesn't give freedom. He is telling the truth so it doesn't give freedom. 
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| R4W-D34THW1SH | May 20 2009, 01:41 AM Post #225 |
The UnderDoG oF LA
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The problem is you dont know if he is lying, Its a yes or no questions and that answer is the most important one. No matter what i think of it always come back as he could be lying. Im truly desperate to hear the answer because ive looked for a similar riddle and couldnt find an answer. its like when i’m right i’m right when i’m wrong i could have been right so im still right because i could have been wrong. i could be wrong right now but im right |
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| Burn Jack | May 20 2009, 10:54 AM Post #226 |
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You don't need to know whether he's lying or not. He answers my question the same way whether he's lying or telling the truth. |
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| blackwinds | May 20 2009, 06:12 PM Post #227 |
Parchment-Maker
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honestly i agree with bj. i had the same thought process goin when i red the question. no matter if hes lying or not, with the question asked as it was you will get the same response either way. |
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| R4W-D34THW1SH | May 20 2009, 08:05 PM Post #228 |
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The UnderDoG oF LA
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Well whats the answer then? Now im trying to think of what i could ask that could cause him to say the same answer. GHAAAAA |
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| ReidE96 | May 20 2009, 09:06 PM Post #229 |
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Mr. Romance
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See, BJ, I think you're thinking what I think the answer is (I don't know the answer, I'll admit it, but I know the idea behind it), but I don't know that you are. I think so, though, so I'll assume you are and say you're right  Basically, you have to give a double barrelled question, where either his answer allows you to determine both his state and which box he says the key is in, or the thing I think BJ has going, which is that his state doesn't matter in the answering as the result is the same. |
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| R4W-D34THW1SH | May 20 2009, 09:26 PM Post #230 |
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The UnderDoG oF LA
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... I googled this $h*T and came up with nothing. Double standard question... im thinking...im thinking... I hate life... |
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| Basilisk | May 23 2009, 05:51 AM Post #231 |
Crier
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He points to a box and asks, "If I choose this box, can I go free?" If the warden answers no, he chooses other box. If the warden answers yes, he chooses that box. Key may be in it. In this case, he goes free. If the key is not in it, he still goes free because the warden said he could 
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| R4W-D34THW1SH | May 23 2009, 07:11 AM Post #232 |
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The UnderDoG oF LA
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BUT he could have been lying about letting him free so he wouldnt ... I honestly dont think this has an answer that i cant dispute... |
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| Mhuahaha | May 23 2009, 11:31 AM Post #233 |
Herder
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BJ, you're forgetting the part that nothing would stop the warden from telling you it gives freedom. So it might as well be: You: Would you tell me it gives me freedom? Warden: Yes (truth, he would tell you if he wanted to) You: So....doesn it give me freedom? Warden: No, it doesn't (truth) |
 Don't ask.... I AM MERELY A FORUM ADMIN. I HAVE NO IN-GAME POWERS. | |
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| Burn Jack | May 23 2009, 05:29 PM Post #234 |
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This is incorrect. My question might* be better worded as follows: "Assuming you were to answer this question and the preceding hypothetical question in the same 'state' (by which I mean telling the truth or lying), if I were to ask you which box would secure my freedom, would you tell me that it was this one?" *points at a box* The warden must choose a single 'state' (telling the truth or lying) for the duration of the question, otherwise he would not be answering my question logically. If he does not have to answer the question logically, I am fairly sure that there is no way to determine which box to take — he might as well pick his answer out of a hat; and how could we possibly determine in that case which box to choose? In your example, the warden answers the preceding hypothetical question ("Which box is it?") and my real question ("Is this the one you'd tell me?") in different 'states': the former he answers untruthfully; the latter truthfully. *I'm still not happy with the wording of the first clause. >__> Also: 
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| Mhuahaha | May 23 2009, 11:38 PM Post #235 |
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It is a very tricky thing indeed. Your new question could logically work. But as it stands, my example would still apply. The question wether he would asnwer you is something which depends on what he wants to at the moment. "Assuming you were to answer this question and the preceding hypothetical question in the same 'state' (by which I mean telling the truth or lying), if I were to ask you which box would secure my freedom, would you tell me that it was this one?" *points at a box* Warden: Yes, I would tell you that that is the box which secures your freedom. He is lying so he wouldn't tell me it was that one. So.. Warden: It doesn't give you freedom. Again, same state, so he is lying again. So it does give you freedom. I cannot provide you the correct answer, I have no clue at the moment, but puncturing holes in your theory I can do right now. |
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Don't ask.... I AM MERELY A FORUM ADMIN. I HAVE NO IN-GAME POWERS. | |
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| HDShocka | May 26 2009, 01:45 AM Post #236 |
Schoolteacher
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Sorry for not getting back soon enough...internet and forgetful memory after all: One Two Three Four Five Six Seven EightNine Ten Eleven Twelve Thirteen Fourteen Fifteen Sixteen Seventeen Eighteen Nineteen Twenty 
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The statement below is true. The statement above is false. | |
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| HDShocka | May 26 2009, 02:13 AM Post #237 |
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Hehe, double use of the word "right" If I choose the right box, will I die? Either yes(lie) or no(truth), the problem said: "2 minutes later, Professor Elbony ran out of the jail, having chosen the right box." The key is in the [knife] [key]<-- right box Linguistic skills over math skills
Edited by HDShocka, May 26 2009, 02:14 AM.
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The statement below is true. The statement above is false. | |
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| R4W-D34THW1SH | May 26 2009, 02:25 AM Post #238 |
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The UnderDoG oF LA
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AHHHHHH I GET IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!! but wait at the same time that doesnt make sense. We were told to figure out what he asked to get freedom. Not which box he picked. He picked the right box and was free, The question is both irrelevant and unknown. Play on words. BOOO |
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| ReidE96 | May 26 2009, 01:41 PM Post #239 |
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Mr. Romance
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...I never thought of that one, Shocka. |
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