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Climate Modeling
Topic Started: May 31 2016, 11:54 PM (210 Views)
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Gee did they have all that nasty CO2 back then?
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Thumper
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I suspect they did but what we are talking about here is changes in the worlds climate patterns in one place affecting the climate half way around the world. This supports my contention that man isn't necessarily responsible for climate change, it is the normal variation of the worlds ocean and jet streams.
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:toasting:
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Berton
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That is correct Thumper. It has been going on since long before man started walking and will go on long after we no longer exist.

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Brewster
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Thumper
Jun 1 2016, 08:37 AM
I suspect they did but what we are talking about here is changes in the worlds climate patterns in one place affecting the climate half way around the world. This supports my contention that man isn't necessarily responsible for climate change, it is the normal variation of the worlds ocean and jet streams.
That's totally silly, Thump.

Climate Change has always existed - there are many different things that can influence Global Climate - nobody has ever denied that.

And the world is one big entity - why wouldn't something happening in one corner of the world influence other areas? That's why emissions in North America, China and India are warming the entire planet.

The difference is this time it's much worse - take a good look at the chart I posted... Never in the history of the Earth has the climate changed so much so fast, except from huge meteor strikes like the one that wiped out the Dinosaurs, or massive numbers of simultaneous volcanic explosions which happened earlier

The ice ages coming and going produced huge changes, but never over a period of one or two centuries - they take millennia.

No, there's no way around it, we're the cause, we're making it happen fast, and we're the ones who can end it.

And if we don't end it, we'll be the ones that suffer.
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yawn2 The only thing missing is another bogus graph.
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Thumper
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Brew, how do we exactly what went on in 1200 AD relative to the speed of onset of the drought that presumably killed a million or so Mayans? Apparently it happened pretty quick since only a few survived. I can't bring myself to believe that it is the slightest bit possible to nail the ancient climate parameters down pat as some are claiming.
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Corky52
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Thumper,
Plenty of ways to pin things down to with a short(three month or less) period for things like rain, temperature, solar energy, and soil moisture. If you check, most of the Mayans didn't starve, social disintegration killed them or diseases got them. Change isn't the problem, rapid change is the problem, tractable problems over decades will kill you when they occur over a year or two. Increase the population and the problem escalates.

Cascading small problems build up over short time periods.


:smoker:
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Brewster
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Thumper
Jun 1 2016, 11:02 AM
Brew, how do we exactly what went on in 1200 AD relative to the speed of onset of the drought that presumably killed a million or so Mayans? Apparently it happened pretty quick since only a few survived. I can't bring myself to believe that it is the slightest bit possible to nail the ancient climate parameters down pat as some are claiming.
Two Words - Tree Rings.

In fact, they're getting so good, they can even tell if a specific year had a wet spring with a hot summer, or vice versa.

I remember one study about a Celtic King's death - Scientists could tell not only the year he died, but the month, by analyzing the flowers in his gravesite - they only bloom in May. A couple of years later, they had confirmation - someone found a book in a monastery giving the date of his death as May 17.

Back to the subject - the event that finished the Mayans was NOT sudden - it took about 150 years, with ups and downs. The Mayans made their own situation worse, as their farming techniques ruined their farmland, made even worse as climate fugitives flooded the cities, increasing the food and water demands - sound familiar?
Edited by Brewster, Jun 1 2016, 11:36 AM.
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