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Obamacare taxing apparatus
Topic Started: Dec 31 2013, 10:32 PM (757 Views)
Berton
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tomdrobin
Jan 4 2014, 05:07 AM
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Jan 4 2014, 04:59 AM
Spoken like a true socialist Tom and incorrect of course.
Show us some facts. Favoring government intervention in some areas where private solutions have failed does not make one a socialist. But, it makes for a great slogan if your short on evidence and facts.

Healthcare has not been left up to private solutions since the beginning of Medicare. If you note, that is when healthcare started going through the roof.

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tomdrobin
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Berton
Jan 4 2014, 05:25 AM
Healthcare has not been left up to private solutions since the beginning of Medicare. If you note, that is when healthcare started going through the roof.

Well then the solution is obvious. Lets get rid of medicare, that should solve the SS underfunding problem also once we quit wasting money keeping the geezers alive.

There are some pretty good right wing arguments that employer furnished health insurance was one of the big drivers in healthcare inflation. That it was a big mistake to give the tax breaks for it.

Quote:
 
2) Real health-insurance reform: Tax employer-provided health care benefits and return the money to the employee with a government check to buy his own medical insurance, just as he buys his own car or home insurance.

There is no logical reason to get health insurance through your employer. This entire system is an accident of World War II wage and price controls. It's economically senseless. It makes people stay in jobs they hate, decreasing labor mobility and therefore overall productivity. And it needlessly increases the anxiety of losing your job by raising the additional specter of going bankrupt through illness.

The health care benefit exemption is the largest tax break in the entire U.S. budget, costing the government a quarter-trillion dollars annually. It hinders health-insurance security and portability as well as personal independence.
If we additionally eliminated the prohibition on buying personal health insurance across state lines, that would inject new and powerful competition that would lower costs for everyone.

Repealing the exemption has one fatal flaw, however. It was advocated by candidate John McCain. Obama so demagogued it last year that he cannot bring it up now without being accused of the most extreme hypocrisy and without being mercilessly attacked with his own 2008 ads.

But that's a political problem of Obama's own making. As is the Democratic Party's indebtedness to the trial lawyers, which has taken malpractice reform totally off the table. But that doesn't change the logic of my proposal. Go the Reagan-Bradley route. Offer sensible, simple, yet radical reform that strips away inefficiencies from the existing system before adding Obamacare's new ones -- arbitrary, politically driven, structural inventions whose consequence is certain financial ruin.


http://townhall.com/columnists/charleskrauthammer/2009/08/07/health_care_reform_a_better_plan/page/full
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campingken
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I agree. Trash Medicare and spend our tax dollars on productive citizens. If a senior for whatever reason didn't sock at least $500,000 away for medical care then let his family bare the burden. If they don't want to well too bad but we all die sometime.

However a large % of the ACA haters enjoy their Medicare. They just don't want anyone else to share their pie...
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colo_crawdad
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But Ken, some are going to argue that Medicare is an insurance for which all have paid. Those folks will ignore thst one hip replacement more than exhausts any amount paid in through payroll tsxes.
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Neutral
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No one is forcing you libs not to pay for your own hospital bills Colo.
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Berton
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tomdrobin
Jan 4 2014, 05:48 AM
Berton
Jan 4 2014, 05:25 AM
Healthcare has not been left up to private solutions since the beginning of Medicare. If you note, that is when healthcare started going through the roof.

Well then the solution is obvious. Lets get rid of medicare, that should solve the SS underfunding problem also once we quit wasting money keeping the geezers alive.

There are some pretty good right wing arguments that employer furnished health insurance was one of the big drivers in healthcare inflation. That it was a big mistake to give the tax breaks for it.

Quote:
 
2) Real health-insurance reform: Tax employer-provided health care benefits and return the money to the employee with a government check to buy his own medical insurance, just as he buys his own car or home insurance.

There is no logical reason to get health insurance through your employer. This entire system is an accident of World War II wage and price controls. It's economically senseless. It makes people stay in jobs they hate, decreasing labor mobility and therefore overall productivity. And it needlessly increases the anxiety of losing your job by raising the additional specter of going bankrupt through illness.

The health care benefit exemption is the largest tax break in the entire U.S. budget, costing the government a quarter-trillion dollars annually. It hinders health-insurance security and portability as well as personal independence.
If we additionally eliminated the prohibition on buying personal health insurance across state lines, that would inject new and powerful competition that would lower costs for everyone.

Repealing the exemption has one fatal flaw, however. It was advocated by candidate John McCain. Obama so demagogued it last year that he cannot bring it up now without being accused of the most extreme hypocrisy and without being mercilessly attacked with his own 2008 ads.

But that's a political problem of Obama's own making. As is the Democratic Party's indebtedness to the trial lawyers, which has taken malpractice reform totally off the table. But that doesn't change the logic of my proposal. Go the Reagan-Bradley route. Offer sensible, simple, yet radical reform that strips away inefficiencies from the existing system before adding Obamacare's new ones -- arbitrary, politically driven, structural inventions whose consequence is certain financial ruin.


http://townhall.com/columnists/charleskrauthammer/2009/08/07/health_care_reform_a_better_plan/page/full

Why do you keep going to extremes? Where did I say we should do away with Medicare? I only pointed out that you were wrong when you said that private solutions have not worked. Private solutions have not been in play for many years now.

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campingken
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Neutral,

We aren't the ones whining about "socialized" medicine.
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Neutral
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Colo was whining, he can pay his own if he really thinks it's hurting the country.
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Banandangees
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campingken
Jan 4 2014, 06:05 AM
I agree. Trash Medicare and spend our tax dollars on productive citizens. If a senior for whatever reason didn't sock at least $500,000 away for medical care then let his family bare the burden. If they don't want to well too bad but we all die sometime.

However a large % of the ACA haters enjoy their Medicare. They just don't want anyone else to share their pie...

Oh geeeese! "spend our tax dollars on productive citizens."


Concerning who tax dollars should be spent on:

Just so we can all understand, who all does Campken include as "productive citizens?

Better yet, just so we can all understand, who all does Campken exclude as those not being "productive citizens?"


Addendum: In your Post above about who is whining about "socialized medicine," I'm not sure anyone is whining about REAL socialized medicine. I never dreamed any American would really want it.
Edited by Banandangees, Jan 5 2014, 04:13 AM.
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campingken
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Productive citizens are those young enough to have positive results from medical care.

Personally I believe that the US should provide health care to all her citizens. However if saving tax dollars is paramount and a choice must be made than our money is better spent on the young.
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