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How does this site look for being factual and unbiased on gun control?
Topic Started: Dec 16 2013, 08:16 AM (1,132 Views)
donsm60
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http://justfacts.com/guncontrol.asp

I scanned the global warming data but not knowing much it about can't say whether it’s factual data one way or the other. The gun control data appears to be accurate knowing a lot about it and can clearly see the murder rate spiking in Florida when the housing crash hit us with hundreds of thousands of people becoming unemployed literally in a few month period.

I realize anti-gun liberals don’t like reality, anything outside of your “utopia” isn’t acceptable and just to clarify my definition of a “liberal” they are just as crazy as the “radical” religious nut cases clinging to the right side of politics today.

Here’s another from NPR.

http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/2013/05/07/181998015/rate-of-u-s-gun-violence-has-fallen-since-1993-study-says

Examine the data read the article then answer three questions honestly. Reality based, not hype or bias because you’re bored with a keyboard.

1. What is the immediate solution to the new trend of mass shootings, especially at schools having 3 in public school?
2. What is the solution to the majority of violent gun crime in America being committed by already convicted felons?
3. Do you think giving your lawful rights away will fix the problems?
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Brewster
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Wonderful articles.

The first took a survey of people's opinions, no facts at all.

The second claimed that violent crime involving guns has gone down, but then quoted a statistic (all causes) that shows that deaths due to guns have gone up.

It doesn't matter WHY they died, THEY STILL DIED.

An interesting chart:

Posted Image

You'll note that deaths have risen / projected to rise steadily since 2000. You're not likely to convince us anti-gun types with stats like that.

I'll repeat one bit of logic I'm sure I've mentioned before:
Quote:
 
Anyone who thinks the answer to the excessive gun violence in the US is yet more guns is not going to be convinced by any reasonable argument.

If there's any group that doesn't like reality, it's the pro-gun types.

I'll answer just one of your questions, the third:
Quote:
 
Do you think giving your lawful rights away will fix the problems?

Let's add a quote from Wikipedia:
Quote:
 
"Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness" is a well-known phrase in the United States Declaration of Independence The phrase gives examples of the various "unalienable rights" which the Declaration says all human beings have been given by their Creator and for the protection of which they institute governments.

The answer to your question should be obvious:

No, I don't think giving away my "inalienable right" to "Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness" just so you can play cowboy will fix ANY problems.
Edited by Brewster, Dec 16 2013, 08:50 AM.
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donsm60
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Brewster, why not answer all three questions honestly?

If you want me to take a Canadian's opinion on global warming seriously when I know you don't even walk your own talk the least you
could do is answer mime.
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colo_crawdad
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I had never heard of the site, "justfacs.com," prior to the OP. So, I did a bit of research. Here is what another site says.

Quote:
 
Justfacts.com

Justfacts is an information site with a strong conservative/libertarian bent. All information on the site is quite accurate, and they regularly exclude information that would benefit their position in the name of honesty and accuracy. They have an extensive page dedicated to understanding the impact of guns and gun control laws on gun violence. They exclude information based on their Standards of Credibility, which present considerable opportunity for subjective bias. Further, they tend to favor raw data over statistical analysis of this data, which can lead readers to natural causation fallacies. The benefit of studies and statistics on this site is that relatively few have been debated for technical reasons.

LINK
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Neutral
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So who has heard of Colo's site? LOL
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donsm60
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Thanks Colo, they seem credible reading the list mentioned along with the NRA.

"Justfacts is an information site with a strong conservative/libertarian bent. All information on the site is quite accurate, and they regularly exclude information that would benefit their position in the name of honesty and accuracy. They have an extensive page dedicated to understanding the impact of guns and gun control laws on gun violence. They exclude information based on their Standards of Credibility, which present considerable opportunity for subjective bias. Further, they tend to favor raw data over statistical analysis of this data, which can lead readers to natural causation fallacies. The benefit of studies and statistics on this site is that relatively few have been debated for technical reasons."

Now spending your career in public education will you answer my 3 simple questions honestly instead of avoiding them? What is the “tomorrow” solution to nuts realizing public schools in America are easy targets?
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Brewster
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donsm60
Dec 16 2013, 08:59 AM
Brewster, why not answer all three questions honestly?

If you want me to take a Canadian's opinion on global warming seriously when I know you don't even walk your own talk the least you
could do is answer mime.
About Warming - I DO walk my talk - as I have said several times, I have cut my carbon footprint to less than a quarter of what it was two-three years ago. If everyone else did even half of what I have, the problem would be solved.

And I DID answer the third question completely honestly.

As far as the first two questions are concerned, there is only one honest answer for both, and you know it: Get rid of the guns.

And don't give me the usual crap about "Only criminals will have guns." If the guns don't exist, the criminals won't have them. There are many statistics that show a large number of criminals buy their guns at what are presently legal outlets, and most of the rest are stolen.

Shut down the legal sources, and the criminals' guns will disappear too.

I'm not naïve enough to believe that passing laws will stop all activity instantly, but every gun removed from circulation is one less chance that somebody will die.

I'm also not naïve enough to think you'll accept the logic of what I just told you.

But it is the truth. You will never end/reduce the gun deaths until you end/reduce the guns.

So now why don't you be as truthful as I just was? Why don't you admit there is no possible answer I or anyone else could give that would convince you to give up your guns, even if the present death rate tripled?
Edited by Brewster, Dec 16 2013, 10:54 AM.
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colo_crawdad
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donsm60
Dec 16 2013, 09:54 AM
Thanks Colo, they seem credible reading the list mentioned along with the NRA.

"Justfacts is an information site with a strong conservative/libertarian bent. All information on the site is quite accurate, and they regularly exclude information that would benefit their position in the name of honesty and accuracy. They have an extensive page dedicated to understanding the impact of guns and gun control laws on gun violence. They exclude information based on their Standards of Credibility, which present considerable opportunity for subjective bias. Further, they tend to favor raw data over statistical analysis of this data, which can lead readers to natural causation fallacies. The benefit of studies and statistics on this site is that relatively few have been debated for technical reasons."

Now spending your career in public education will you answer my 3 simple questions honestly instead of avoiding them? What is the “tomorrow” solution to nuts realizing public schools in America are easy targets?
My focus on the report concerning the site is in a bit different place than yours. My focus is on the right wing conservative bias of the site. I guess that fact does not matter much to you. It does to me.
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Brewster
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Actually the site seems more honest than most with its Right Wing slant.

But depending upon laymen's opinions is never going to give an accurate result no matter how scrupulously the data is gathered.

And neither will cherry picking just one type of shooting, as the second link does.
Edited by Brewster, Dec 16 2013, 10:46 AM.
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Pat
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I think you ignored the fact that criminal elements import guns Brew or steal them from military sources. So your belief that if legal guns are removed that all will be rosy is inaccurate. What it would mean is that the sheep would be defenseless.

In answering Don's questions I'll start off with one example. How to protect our schools and public places. At the most recent school shooting, the guard was armed and that prevented a massacre. So having armed guards and teachers would go a long way in preventing school massacres.

I don't believe that forfeiting my rights would solve the violence in our country. Criminals would still kill people with guns, families and friends would still enable their mentally ill and violent children and neighbors. As far as the felon situation, automatic death penalty and immediate execution.
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