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Why there is no global warming war and never has been; history
Topic Started: Dec 15 2013, 02:25 AM (1,351 Views)
Brewster
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I think your "Wind Effect" is begging quite a different question...

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Pat
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Brewster
Dec 19 2013, 01:59 AM
I think your "Wind Effect" is begging quite a different question...

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:smile: The whisper affect, I like that one and will put it to use, when the crowd starts making funny faces at me I'll calmly state that next time I'll raise my volume over the whisper. Or something along that line.
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Berton
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Brewster
Dec 19 2013, 01:04 AM
It would impress me more if he used the Latin terms correctly.

I think what he's trying to say, in his unique, garbled style, is "argument from authority", which would be "Argumentum ab auctoritate"

The term he used, "Argumentum ad verecundiam" is grammatically incorrect. It should be "Argumentum ab verecundiam".

But regardless of the grammar, the meaning is wrong anyway - it translates as "argument from shame", and I doubt very much that Telco was ashamed of what he said, or felt he was not qualified to comment.

But of course, bad translation or not, Berton is dead wrong in his accusation that Telco was caught in a logical fallacy.

The fallacy applies when the authority being quoted has no expertise in the field in question.

One example: A Denier favourite - The Oregon Petition - "30,000 Scientists Reject AGW". That is a logical fallacy because those "scientists" could be anything, from Biology teachers to Dentists. What does a Dentist know about Climate Science?

In this case, Telco is using articles from real Climatologists, so Berton's claim is completely wrong.

As his claims always are.

On Edit:

I just reviewed Bertie's sentence. Four words, four errors - that must be close to a record!
The phrase argumentum ad verecundiam is sometimes used synonymously to mean 'argument from authority'. While it is linked, it does not have the same meaning. The Latin noun verecundia means "modesty" or "shame". Its link to arguments from authority is that they are used to make those who lack authority feel shame about discussing issues they lack credentials of expertise in, and modestly back out of an argument. The reason it is a fallacy is that the stature of the person to whom the remark is directed is precisely the open question under debate.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argument_from_authority

and

http://philosophy.lander.edu/logic/authority.html

and

http://www.fallacyfiles.org/authorit.html

Your argument is Argumentum ad hominem
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Berton
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telcoman
Dec 19 2013, 01:33 AM
It is pretty hard to come up with a convincing argument when you are trying to base real science on political opinion & bias which is where Berton is at. The problem is poltiics are never about facts, science by definiton generally is.

So the scientific facts will win over Bertons politics any day. People who try to corrupt science with poltical dogma are not that uncommon, they have been around since the middle ages.

More Argumentum ad ignorantiam with Argumentum ad hominem added in.

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