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Caterpillar Strikes Deal to Build Georgia Plant
Topic Started: Feb 18 2012, 08:31 PM (1,545 Views)
jackd
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Carterpillar bought the Canadian company in 2010.....
Carterpillar pockets Canadian and/or provincial subsidies
2 years later, Carterpillar walks away.
They could not even plan 2 years ahead.????
It look like Carterpillar only wanted to illiminate a competitor in Canada.
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Deleted User
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Some of the liberal arguments here are funny, as if moving to where Cat saves on costs is stupid or evil, and some even twist a job loss into a gain and a job gain into a loss. Companies stay in business by eliminating inefficiencies in order to better compete. That keeps them open. And guess what, that results in jobs and the savings gets passed off to customers in lower prices.


Chris you are missing a basic principle in economics. Our system relies on consumers & their power to spend. A company saving money may result in some price reductions, but when you multiply that 1000's of times with cheap wages, in the end they are slitting their own throats. I suspect a large part of the current turndown is a direct or indirect result of it. We live in a closed system. Open the circle at any point it will have negative effects. When people discuss economics they often overlook the obvious, because the effect is delayed and not immediately apparent..
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Quote:
 
Carterpillar bought the Canadian company in 2010.....
Carterpillar pockets Canadian and/or provincial subsidies
2 years later, Carterpillar walks away.
They could not even plan 2 years ahead.????
It look like Carterpillar only wanted to illiminate a competitor in Canada.


It would seem that way.
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Chris
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Mike
Feb 18 2012, 11:03 PM
The experience in the aircraft business has not been a reduction of wages by 50%, when a company opens plants in a right to work state. Nor has is been that way in the automobile manufacturing sector. I believe most company opposition arrives when blue collar workers, insist on having a say in management areas, long considered sacred to the company. Work rules and retention rules have resulted in a loss of jobs in this country. I believe American workers for the most part, realize that tough bargaining in some areas is a losing proposition long term.

It's wonderful that Caterpillar is giving us a second chance. One only review what has happened in the rust belt... and especially the auto industry to grasp what happens when companies are backed up against the wall.
I don't see workers bargaining for better salaries, work conditions, etc as a problem, it is however when they make demands, often backed by government force, that threaten to put a company out of business.
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Chris
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jackd
Feb 18 2012, 11:14 PM
Carterpillar bought the Canadian company in 2010.....
Carterpillar pockets Canadian and/or provincial subsidies
2 years later, Carterpillar walks away.
They could not even plan 2 years ahead.????
It look like Carterpillar only wanted to illiminate a competitor in Canada.
"Carterpillar pockets Canadian and/or provincial subsidies"

It would be interesting to hear you explain that, if you didn't have me on ignore.
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I don't see workers bargaining for better salaries, work conditions, etc as a problem, it is however when they make demands, often backed by government force, that threaten to put a company out of business.


In the case in Canada it does not seem the union workers were making demands, The exact opposite in fact. If you read the article, the company refused to negotiate, period.

The only government factor was in allowing caterpillar to purchase an existing Canadian competitor.
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Chris
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telcoman
Feb 18 2012, 11:17 PM
Quote:
 
Some of the liberal arguments here are funny, as if moving to where Cat saves on costs is stupid or evil, and some even twist a job loss into a gain and a job gain into a loss. Companies stay in business by eliminating inefficiencies in order to better compete. That keeps them open. And guess what, that results in jobs and the savings gets passed off to customers in lower prices.


Chris you are missing a basic principle in economics. Our system relies on consumers & their power to spend. A company saving money may result in some price reductions, but when you multiply that 1000's of times with cheap wages, in the end they are slitting their own throats. I suspect a large part of the current turndown is a direct or indirect result of it. We live in a closed system. Open the circle at any point it will have negative effects. When people discuss economics they often overlook the obvious, because the effect is delayed and not immediately apparent..
OK, so tell me what basic economic principle you're talking about that I'm missing. You sort of skipped over that.


"We live in a closed system."

Inasmuch as resources are limited. However, wealth is not, it is created through work, created in exchange, including the exchange of work for pay.
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Thumper
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Market forces will straighten it all out. That's why we see so much heavy equipment now that is not Caterpillar yellow.
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Chris
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telcoman
Feb 18 2012, 11:21 PM
Quote:
 
I don't see workers bargaining for better salaries, work conditions, etc as a problem, it is however when they make demands, often backed by government force, that threaten to put a company out of business.


In the case in Canada it does not seem the union workers were making demands, The exact opposite in fact. If you read the article, the company refused to negotiate, period.

The only government factor was in allowing caterpillar to purchase an existing Canadian competitor.
I was commenting on Mike's general point, telco.

"the company refused to negotiate"

It has that right. It had a better offer elsewhere. But this speaks to my more general point, bargaining is fine, demanding is not.
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Brewster
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I don't know what the percent cut was in the aircraft industry, but Cat was insisting on 50% in Ontario.
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