Welcome Guest [Log In] [Register]
Welcome to Edl The Forum. We hope you enjoy your visit.


You're currently viewing our forum as a guest. This means you are limited to certain areas of the board and there are some features you can't use. If you join our community, you'll be able to access member-only sections, and use many member-only features such as customizing your profile, sending personal messages, and voting in polls. Registration is simple, fast, and completely free.


Join our community!


If you're already a member please log in to your account to access all of our features:

Username:   Password:
Add Reply
Humiliate, strip, threaten:; UK military interrogation manuals discovered
Topic Started: Oct 26 2010, 12:28 PM (265 Views)
AQH
No Avatar
Patriot
:X if true.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2010/oct/25/uk-military-interrogation-manuals

Although I understand to some degree the need for such methods, these leaks can so easily be used against regular folks and regular troops who never breached the Geneva convention, to "justify" violence..
:$
Edited by AQH, Oct 26 2010, 12:40 PM.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
jojo edl angel
Member Avatar
Member
The court is not thought to be aware of the material obtained by The Guardian

^o) Derr! It bloody is now! How the hell does this sort of sensentive & potentially dangerous information get leaked in the first place! Guaranteed it always does just when its needed!
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Deleted User
Deleted User

This really winds me up... What would happen if one of ours got nabbed by the Tali? Now that is proper toucher followed by a public beheading.

Lets just be thankful that does not happen often.

Now as for the lefties being upset by some of the methods or humiliated... Well its war, its tough. Our enemy get treated a dam sight better then we are treated by them.
Quote Post Goto Top
 
AQH
No Avatar
Patriot
ADW
Oct 26 2010, 01:26 PM


Now as for the lefties being upset by some of the methods or humiliated... Well its war, its tough. Our enemy get treated a dam sight better then we are treated by them.
During WW2 Allies made sure they treated war prisoners according to Geneva conventions, unlike Soviets who wiped arse with such papers. German POW's in Britain were even fed better than an average briton civilian! Some spent christmas holidays with british families and some were even taken to see proper english football games. Hat tip to that.

Seems we have come a looong way from proper manners and a gentlemanly way of warring of our forefathers, if the bar now is lowered at the level "better than by them" It is not enough, is it now?
Edited by AQH, Oct 26 2010, 01:44 PM.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Deleted User
Deleted User

AQ, how else are you going to make a hard core jihaddiest talk? Remember these are the people that use woman and children as weapons.

I'm no condoning toucher just sometimes you cant be nice all the time.

As for the likeness drawn to POWs in WWII its totally different. While the Russians and Jap's were harsh and the English/Americans better at treating there prisoners Jahadists sink to a whole new level.

At what point do we actually start dealing with these people or should we simple let them take over?
Quote Post Goto Top
 
AQH
No Avatar
Patriot
I'm not going to argue over this one ADW.

All I'm saying is that war is dirty, and sometimes one needs to stretch the rules, so to speak, but it shouldn't become a standard procedure. Or at least for Christ's sake make no fcuking manuals and documents about it..

Cheers.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Deleted User
Deleted User

I'm not going to argue either... But what I will point out is that in the 2nd world war the allies were not always as good as the movies make them out. There are a number of documented cases of abuse by our troops.

However, like I said earlier there is a disconnect between what people think happens and what actually happens. Asking a jihaddest nicely not to reach for his gun will get you or your buddy killed.

Where ever possible of course we must maintain the moral high ground. But how do you do that when the opposition are so totally hell bent on both there own and your destruction.

As for operation manuals, it is better to set a framework than to say "get it done". As that can lead to unmarked mass graves.
Quote Post Goto Top
 
jayfer72
Member Avatar
Kafir
ok this report is utter bollox...i can say this with a smile on my face...

it is all unfounded there are no "torture manuals" and deffo no powerpoint presentations like what they have described..

typical journos twisting and making up utter bollox to sell newspapers....

blindfolds are initially used on point of capture until within a facility, earmuffs used if passing through a sensitive area!...and of course UK approved hand restraints are used in accordance with UK law and the geneva convention. All prisoners are stripped and searched, then placed into POW clothing. The poice in the UK do this and it is an approved method!....FFS

i shall say no more on this topic, but trust what i say as i know what im talking about.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
AQH
No Avatar
Patriot
I'm on the same page with you ADW.

jayfer72, I hope this is bollox, you never know with media today.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
jayfer72
Member Avatar
Kafir
trust me it is.....its biased media reporting again - jumping on the recent revelations of the US reports....

dont believe the hype - a very good song by NWA..
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
lan-astaslem
Member Avatar
Patriot
This article stinks of poppy cock, and who ever wrote it should learn about mohammedans

Quote:
 
The training material recommends that after a prisoner's clothes are removed, the interrogator ensures he is searched behind his foreskin and that his buttocks are spread.





“One day, millions of men will leave the Southern Hemisphere to go to the Northern Hemisphere. And they will not go there as friends. Because they will go there to conquer it. And they will conquer it with their sons. The wombs of our women will give us victory.”

– Houari (Mohamed) Boumedienne, President of Algeria, 1965 – 1978, in a 1974 speech at the UN

Posted Image
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
The Swine
Member Avatar
Kafir
Its hardly worse than a prison strip search and you get that for non payment of council tax!
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Deleted User
Deleted User

ADW
Oct 26 2010, 02:00 PM
AQ, how else are you going to make a hard core jihaddiest talk? Remember these are the people that use woman and children as weapons.

I'm no condoning toucher just sometimes you cant be nice all the time.

As for the likeness drawn to POWs in WWII its totally different. While the Russians and Jap's were harsh and the English/Americans better at treating there prisoners Jahadists sink to a whole new level.

At what point do we actually start dealing with these people or should we simple let them take over?
Information gleaned by torture is totally unreliable.
Saying that I don't think this is torture, just making it uncomfortable is not torturing them.
Just finished a book by a British lawyer who visited Jihad suspects in Guantanamo, now if the British were doing what the Yanks are doing then I would have reservations
Quote Post Goto Top
 
Steve Freedom
No Avatar
Patriot
lan-astaslem
Oct 26 2010, 03:10 PM
This article stinks of poppy cock, and who ever wrote it should learn about mohammedans

Quote:
 
The training material recommends that after a prisoner's clothes are removed, the interrogator ensures he is searched behind his foreskin and that his buttocks are spread.





MUSLIMS DO NOT HAVE FORESKIN IT IS REMOVED AT EIGHT DAYS OLD


if they are going to bullsh1t at least use correct facts ffs
“The modern definition of "racist" is "someone who is winning an argument with a liberal” --- Peter Brimelow
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
learning curve
Member Avatar
Member
cant agree with it all without having seen the leaked material, but some degree of torture nessasary and is part of any interogation prossess and fully understand that some rules will be broken in certain situations to get intel that could save lives on or off the front lines.
Edited by learning curve, Oct 26 2010, 05:03 PM.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Deleted User
Deleted User

AQ-Hunter
Oct 26 2010, 01:37 PM
ADW
Oct 26 2010, 01:26 PM


Now as for the lefties being upset by some of the methods or humiliated... Well its war, its tough. Our enemy get treated a dam sight better then we are treated by them.
During WW2 Allies made sure they treated war prisoners according to Geneva conventions, unlike Soviets who wiped arse with such papers. German POW's in Britain were even fed better than an average briton civilian! Some spent christmas holidays with british families and some were even taken to see proper english football games. Hat tip to that.

Seems we have come a looong way from proper manners and a gentlemanly way of warring of our forefathers, if the bar now is lowered at the level "better than by them" It is not enough, is it now?
I think that's the way it outa be. If your enemy is a legitimate force ( not a guerrilla warfare tactic type of army ) I still hold a certain respect for them, because if I was captured by them I would hope they would treat me with the same respect. I heard that the Germans treated our POW's fairly well but I could be wrong... it was the Japanese and Russians that you didn't want to end up in their POW camps..
Quote Post Goto Top
 
lan-astaslem
Member Avatar
Patriot
Steve Freedom
Oct 26 2010, 04:47 PM
MUSLIMS DO NOT HAVE FORESKIN IT IS REMOVED AT EIGHT DAYS OLD
No it is the jewish practice to cut at eight days. where as muslims it is when the boy is 7-10

Whilst Jewish circumcision is closely bound by ritual timing and tradition, Islamic circumcision does not have a strictly mandated procedure, or form of circumcision. These tend to change across cultures, families, and time. In some Islamic countries circumcision is performed after Mohammedan boys have learnt to recite the whole of the Qur'an from start to finish. In Malaysia and Indonesia and other regions, the boy usually undergoes the operation between the ages of ten and twelve, and is thus a puberty rite, serving to introduce him into the new status of an adult. The procedure is sometimes semi-public, accompanied with music, special foods, and much festivity

They squeal like pigs when captured and make allegations of being hooded, of electric shocks, of sound deprivation through the use of earmuffs, of sleep deprivation, of sight deprivation using blackened goggles, of enforced nakedness and kept awake by pornographic DVDs played on laptops. Yet it is a time of much festivity, music, special foods when they sexually mutilate their children
“One day, millions of men will leave the Southern Hemisphere to go to the Northern Hemisphere. And they will not go there as friends. Because they will go there to conquer it. And they will conquer it with their sons. The wombs of our women will give us victory.”

– Houari (Mohamed) Boumedienne, President of Algeria, 1965 – 1978, in a 1974 speech at the UN

Posted Image
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
TodeSLichT
Member Avatar
Member
As far as I am aware, the Taliban and such are not covered by the geneva convention anyway, because they disguise themselves as civilians. Thus meaning they can (and arguably SHOULD) be shot upon capture.

Whilst they refuse to fight like men, we should treat them like the barbarous animals they are! Execute every last one of them for war crimes.


http://www.warriorsfortruth.com/geneva-convention-rules.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prisoner_of_war#Qualifications

Now, the first link provides an interesting viewpoint from some Yank. The second shows that we would be quite within our rights to execute any and all taliban prisoners. And we fcuking well should do.
Edited by TodeSLichT, Oct 26 2010, 06:51 PM.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Deleted User
Deleted User

There's a good film that shows a good justification for torture (very good film in fact). If you fancy watching it, it's called 'unthinkable'.
Preview...
http://www.imdb.com/video/screenplay/vi3681814297/
TodeSLichT
Oct 26 2010, 06:46 PM
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prisoner_of_war#Qualifications
... shows that we would be quite within our rights to execute any and all taliban prisoners. And we fcuking well should do.
This was interesting...
Wikipedia - Prisoner_of_war
 
Qualifications
To be entitled to prisoner-of-war status, captured service members must be lawful combatants entitled to combatant's privilege—which gives them immunity from punishment for crimes constituting lawful acts of war, e.g., killing enemy troops. To qualify under the Third Geneva Convention, a combatant must have conducted military operations according to the laws and customs of war, be part of a chain of command, wear a "fixed distinctive marking, visible from a distance" and bear arms openly. Thus, uniforms and/or badges are important in determining prisoner-of-war status; and francs-tireurs, terrorists, saboteurs, mercenaries and spies do not qualify. In practice, these criteria are rarely interpreted strictly. Guerrillas, for example, usually do not wear a uniform or carry arms openly, yet captured guerrillas are often granted POW status.
Quote Post Goto Top
 
Idjut Bungmewonga
Member Avatar
Patriot
My understanding of the British Army's study of "robust interrogation" is that it is analised and then they put their own soldiers/special forces through it so that they know how to withstand it if its done to them, rather than teaching them how to do it themselves.
Winston Churchill on Islam ; ' The fact that in Mohammedan law every woman must belong to some man as his absolute property, either as a child, a wife, or a concubine, must delay the final extinction of slavery until the faith of Islam has ceased to be a great power among men. Individual Moslems may show splendid qualities - but the influence of the religion paralyses the social development of those who follow it. No stronger retrograde force exists in the world....
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
General Pershing
Member Avatar
Patriot
I fcuking hate the media! I don't care what our troops did, they deserve to be honoured, not investigated and demonised.

War is war and it's not a bed of roses. These left wing fcuks in the media want to diss our troops when they have no fcuking idea what it's like to go to war and risk life and limb in a desert hell hole. fcuk the press, fcuk the media and fcuk these inquiries. War is war and our troops deserve praise for their service to this country and their reputation must be defended.

fcuk these cnuts who want to bring disrespect on our troops. They should be hung for treason. Dirty fcuking bastards! Let them walk in their shoes before they open their gobs. Wouldn't last a fcuking minute over there.
Posted Image
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
BomberHarris
Member Avatar
Member
Have to agree that certain tactics used against prisoners may not look pretty to civilians but this is War - and yet again, we didn't start it!
I do think that we were known for our fairness in our treatment of POWs, it would be nice to think that our Troops still behave in such a way but maybe not possible in some circumstances.
Our forces face things that most of us can't even begin to imagine although certain programs are helping to show the dangers they face. These people will use any method to kill and maim our Soldiers and really deserve worse than the article reports IMHO.
I do doubt very much the truth in much of this report though. It does beggar belief that this sort of thing should
make the newspapers. Whilst understanding the need to fill & sell a paper it would be refreshing to see
our Tabloids & BS supporting our Soldiers and being a little more patriotic.

What's the saying? "If you don't stand behind British Soldiers feel free to stand in front of them " :D
"If I should die, think only this of me:
That there's some corner of a foreign field
That is forever England."
RBL Great Poppy Party Celebrate 90 years of the RBL in 2011




Yes, I am a girl...
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
General Pershing
Member Avatar
Patriot
BomberHarris
Oct 26 2010, 10:02 PM
Have to agree that certain tactics used against prisoners may not look pretty to civilians but this is War - and yet again, we didn't start it!
I do think that we were known for our fairness in our treatment of POWs, it would be nice to think that our Troops still behave in such a way but maybe not possible in some circumstances.
Our forces face things that most of us can't even begin to imagine although certain programs are helping to show the dangers they face. These people will use any method to kill and maim our Soldiers and really deserve worse than the article reports IMHO.
I do doubt very much the truth in much of this report though. It does beggar belief that this sort of thing should
make the newspapers. Whilst understanding the need to fill & sell a paper it would be refreshing to see
our Tabloids & BS supporting our Soldiers and being a little more patriotic.

What's the saying? "If you don't stand behind British Soldiers feel free to stand in front of them " :D
Pretty much my philosophy on the matter. One British troop is worth more than the entire Iraqi population. fcuk Iraq! fcuk Iran, fcuk the entire middle east in fact. Those are our sons and grandsons over there fighting for our country. Respect them and honour them, stand up for them and support them. Since WHEN was it alright to do everything in your power to make them look like the bad guys??? fcuk THE PRESS, fcuk THEM ALL! Don't know who's worse sometime, Anjem Choudary and his fcukwit chums with their 'Butchers of Basara' banners or the British???? press!?!?
Posted Image
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Johnnyg
No Avatar

War is war and you arent gonna get intel from captives by offering them a cup of tea! As others have pointed out the enemy would certainly treat our captive soldiers far more severely.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
tobias malachi
No Avatar
Infidel
We are fighting terrorist's so the articals of war dont or should not apply. those making this information public are traitors and should be treated as such.
Some one said ''If you cannot stand behind our troops stand in front of them'' and take the bullet.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
aluman
No Avatar
Patriot
Im staying right out of this one ? ill get baned
ALUMAN HAS BEEN GAGGED FOR TELLING THE TRUTH
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
AQH
No Avatar
Patriot
Some of you are making here a good point about talibanis and other terrorists not being under Geneva convention.

Never thought of that.
Edited by AQH, Oct 26 2010, 10:49 PM.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Deleted User
Deleted User

It would be interesting to see how effective torture is; when used on a Muslim. I think they believe that any pain they could ever possibly feel in this life, is nothing compared to the eternal pain they will feel when they die - if they give-in to the "infidels".
Quote Post Goto Top
 
1 user reading this topic (1 Guest and 0 Anonymous)
« Previous Topic · EDL Chat · Next Topic »
Add Reply

Feliz Navidad (Gold) created by Sarah & Delirium of the ZNR