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| Putting the foundations of a left-defender organization | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: 10 Jan 2014, 19:32 (1,039 Views) | |
| Misley | 1 Feb 2014, 21:55 Post #11 |
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Squadron Admiral of The Red Fleet
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The bigger difference as I see it is one of visibility. The name "The Red Fleet" is one that has years of history behind it and is well known in the Fascist/Antifascist side of NS. A new organization would not have the same level of name recognition and clout right off the bat. |
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The Rose Commune of Caelapes Former Comrade WA Delegate and Custodian of The Internationale Offsite Administrator for the NSLeft Solidarity Pact Durruti Squadron Admiral of The Red Fleet | |
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| Grobladonia | 1 Feb 2014, 22:14 Post #12 |
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"Party Leader"
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One of the issues I face between now and when I first started taking steps towards this objective back in December is that I have a lot less time than I did back then. Not only have I been elected MDA here but I also got a job IRL, which means I don't have even half the time to dedicate to this as I used to. There may be advantages in partnering up with TRF to get this off the ground. I'm not sure what to say at the moment. |
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The United Socialist States of Grobladonia "In Cats We Trust" ![]() Charter Nation of the Democratic Socialist Assembly Former Ambassador to the Communist International League Minister of Domestic Affairs | |
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| Grobladonia | 7 Feb 2014, 21:50 Post #13 |
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"Party Leader"
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So, the Liberation of Nazi Europe has been repealed and its delegate has expressed some not-so-unexpected vengeful feelings towards the left. In these circumstances there is a greater need for more people out there to help keep the left safe. So the question of founding a left-defender organization has become more urgent. What do we do? Do we try and start this up from scratch or team up with The Red Fleet instead? |
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The United Socialist States of Grobladonia "In Cats We Trust" ![]() Charter Nation of the Democratic Socialist Assembly Former Ambassador to the Communist International League Minister of Domestic Affairs | |
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| Misley | 7 Feb 2014, 22:20 Post #14 |
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Squadron Admiral of The Red Fleet
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This is precisely why The Internationale and The Red Fleet were strongly AGAINST the repeal of Liberate Nazi Europe. Now the Left is going to feel the reverberations of a newly mobile Fascist force. The Red Fleet has the organization and infrastructure already in place to respond to threats, and we are already working in solidarity with the Lazarene Liberation Army on leftist defense missions. If you're interested in joining TRF, post a rating application at http://ns-comintern.proboards.com/board/19/fleets-red-navy and a Commissar will review it and get in touch with you. If you're interested in joining specifically for defensive operations ("Home Fleet"), fill out a rating application and telegram me, Misley. Edited by Misley, 7 Feb 2014, 22:24.
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The Rose Commune of Caelapes Former Comrade WA Delegate and Custodian of The Internationale Offsite Administrator for the NSLeft Solidarity Pact Durruti Squadron Admiral of The Red Fleet | |
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| Kryftland | 7 Feb 2014, 22:42 Post #15 |
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"Debater"
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Are you still considering this? I feel that we are in grave need of a united left wing defense coalition. Me, the the CIL delegate (the irony), and Socialist Space Republic were discussing setting up one for a long time, but inactivity stopped us. With Nazi Europe now released from their seige, I think no one should underestimate the Right Wing Uprising, and that all NS leftists should take some action to ensure our mutual security regardless of attitudes to the antifascist cause. The best solution would be for everyone to unite in an experienced and organised force - The Red Fleet - but I respect the fact that many do not agree with raiding for various reasons. I myself joined the RDC rather than the Red Fleet because I dislike their ranking and their elitist leadership, which is an exclusive clique. Moreover, what has put me off the Red Fleet is my not so inclusive nor educational experience with them. I had been a part of the Red Fleet for a long time, and despite asking for more information about how the organisation functioned, and so on, multiple times, I still know less about it than any non-member! A problem with all the antifa organisations in general, including the RDC, is the way in which they formulate a binary conflict between fascists and communists, which has become a pissing contest of who holds the most trophy regions. If these, among other, faults could be addressed by a new organisation, soley for defending leftists, I think it would gain a lot of support. Regarding the planned coalition with our allies: although I think basing a military on our alliance would provide a firm base upon which to start the organisation, I dislike the fact that (what should be) a united defense force would be based on specific regions, especially as the regions in question have a liberal leaning and a bad history with some other leftists which may cause problems when it comes to unity and inclusiveness. Also, if decisions for the coalition were to be made by the governments of the alliance regions, then it would be corrupted by bureaucracy and lack of transparency. Ideally, a left wing military organisation should follow the principles it is defending as far as is practically possible. This would mean equality (no ranks) and an open leadership, preferably a leadership that is elected (on the basis of ability and trust). It should be an open and inclusive militia tied together by solidarity between comrades regardless of ideological tendencies and regardless of good/bad personal/regional relations. |
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| Misley | 7 Feb 2014, 23:11 Post #16 |
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Squadron Admiral of The Red Fleet
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With respect to the Fleet's organization, I recognize that as a problem (it's something I've come up against myself in my time in the Fleet) and I'm working with the other members of the Commissariat to update our organizational practices and make that far more clear for both our members and the public. I don't necessarily view the ranking or leadership as "elitist," but I know that it conflicts with anarchist views which is why Comrade Casita is organizing Autonomous Brigades that operate as a part of the Fleet without the formal hierarchy. |
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The Rose Commune of Caelapes Former Comrade WA Delegate and Custodian of The Internationale Offsite Administrator for the NSLeft Solidarity Pact Durruti Squadron Admiral of The Red Fleet | |
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| Kryftland | 7 Feb 2014, 23:40 Post #17 |
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"Debater"
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Well thank you for acknoweldging my concerns. The reason I dismissed The Red Fleet without considering the possibility of its reform is because I had brought up these issues before on The Internationale's RMB, and I was mostly ignored. It is good to hear that you and the Commissariat are now considering reform - I will be interested to see if any action is taken. Perhaps 'elitist' is not quite the right word, but the organisation of TRF does not sit well with me. The Autonomous Brigades sound appealing to me, although I would have to overlook Casita's history. Please note that my criticism of the TRF's organisation is not a personal slight against you or any other member. |
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| Misley | 8 Feb 2014, 00:00 Post #18 |
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Squadron Admiral of The Red Fleet
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Understood! I never took it as a slight against me or anyone else, and your reservations are fair. I'm not an anarchist, so I personally find a hierarchy (especially for a military-type organization like TRF) appealing, but I understand and accept why that doesn't sit well with y'all. Comrade Casita is a long-time anarchist member of The Internationale and the Fleet. He was promoted to Commodore of the Fleet before being appointed to the Commissariat, though I'm not sure how fond he is of the titles, haha. He is the founder of the anarchist region "Autonomous Peoples" and most recently served as the defender delegate of Makhnovia before and after it was invaded. If you're interested, send him a telegram. He can give you more info on that side of the Fleet, as it's sort of his baby. Sorry that your concerns with the Fleet weren't addressed before - I think the old Admiralty had been stagnating for a while and the deletion of La Pas dealt a major blow that we're still recovering from. Thankfully Marxingrad got a few of us pulled together to address these sorts of issues, so hopefully we do a good job of it. |
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The Rose Commune of Caelapes Former Comrade WA Delegate and Custodian of The Internationale Offsite Administrator for the NSLeft Solidarity Pact Durruti Squadron Admiral of The Red Fleet | |
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| Remean Lord | 12 Feb 2014, 21:22 Post #19 |
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"Bothered to vote"
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This may disrupt the current conversation upon this topic, however, I drafted a super-national defense organization (Socialist Defense League) after the calamity that arose during the invasion and occupation of the Communist International League. It never really panned out, and to this date I only have an outlining document as a basis for it. Anyways, after the invasion of Communist International recently, I feel that it might be of some use. The document can be found below on a google doc on this link: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1IFC_Ch33JHnQU8T_IsmAUkxPwOL8yAj2tYJ2Bj60xm4/edit?usp=sharing If you have any questions or comments after viewing, please telegram me (The Remean Lordship). I will be only happy to answer questions on the topic. |
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| United Federation of Canada | 15 Feb 2014, 02:04 Post #20 |
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Resouluton Author Extraordinaire
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Interesting idea..... I would be down for a strictly DEFENSIVE military component of the alliance. As for the involvement/joining of The Red Fleet, I highly opposed to such an agreement, and will adamantly refuse to participate in such operations. The Red Fleet, and by it nature Antifa are nothing more than raiders, who have brought any grief they suffer upon themselves. I have a very bad feeling that if they are involved with us, in any way shape of form, they are going to bring the wrath of god down upon us, and leave us swinging in the breeze when the chips are down.... |
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The Right Honorable Chester B. Pearson, Prime Minister United Federation of Canada Jean Pierre Trudeau, Chief Ambassador United Federation of Canada, Premier The North American Union | |
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