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linean taxonomy vs cladestics
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Topic Started: Jun 15 2018, 12:33 PM (614 Views)
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flashman63
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Jun 18 2018, 08:57 PM
Post #16
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Cladistics are useful in mapping evolutionary paths and relationships, Linnaean taxonomy in sorting animals for other purposes as it's more intuitive. I prefer cladistics, but I don't despise Linnaen taxonomy as much as me people here seem to.
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Dr Nitwhite
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Jun 18 2018, 09:17 PM
Post #17
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I don't really think it's despicable at all really. You are very right about intuitive, for general purposes I actually think it's quite useful. But when you're creating a project based on evolutionary change, it doesn't make much sense to use.
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LittleLazyLass
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Jun 18 2018, 10:09 PM
Post #18
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I never saw how Linnaean is somehow more intuitive. It just adds an extra thing to remember, what rank everything is.
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totally not British, b-baka!
You like me (Unlike) I don't even really like this song that much but the title is pretty relatable sometimes, I guess.
Me  Forum user Uncanny Gemstar drew what is supposed to be a me. Thanks! Spoiler: click to toggle As they walk in, they're greeted by a small, poorly kept pathway leading to a poorly constructed Japanese-style gate. Behind this, a small field made up of corn, rice, wheat, potatoes, among other plants is contrasted by large piles of books, as well as a few rather out of place looking laptops. Off in the corner, a small woman, with long, striped, and strikingly colorful socks, no shoes, unremarkable denim shorts, a large, fancy black coat, arm warmers, glasses, a tuque, and somewhat unkempt, mid-length blue-and-pink-streaked red hair, is rummaging through a trash bin, located behind a sign saying "employees only". She continues this for a while (walking behind a wall to change her outfit now and then), until one of her visitors coughs. Startled, she looks up, apologizes, and grabs a handful of textbooks and novels before daintily running off to join them. What, you want me to tell you what these mean? Predenterra The (Lost) Lost World The Standing World Read First Clarifications on my sex and genderSorry if I come off as rude, I don't put much thought into word choice sometimes. I'm also super prone to editing my posts, sometimes multiple times, in the minutes following posting. For the love of god, take my posts from my earlier days on the forum with a grain of salt. I was not particularly knowledgeable or mature back then. Some of them are so cringe-worthy I can't even bring myself to look at them. Words Maybe Great Words - Words To Spec By
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Ignorance is never insulting if you're willing to learn, we're all ignorant about most things. ~~The Words of Lamna
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Yeah, and even if you don't agree with creationists on that concept, that doesn't mean they can't be decent people. I have friends who are creationist (possibly even young earth) that I get along with fine in general life. I don't think they're right of course, but that doesn't make them intellectual degenerates. ~~The Words of forbidden3
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And last night I dreamed I was blowing up a Kindergarten with a grenade launcher for no particular reason...
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Even though he is our creator, that does not afford him the right to take our lives on a whim. But that is the thinking of a homs. He is a god. Such morals cannot apply to gods. So you think we should just shut up and die?! If that is the fate decided by a god. You are mistaken if you think we will simply accept such a fate and wait to die. We'll never stop fighting. Not till the end. To Zanza, the outcome is the same. Thus your logic is flawed.
- Hades - Kid Icarus Uprising
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When freaky aliens give you lemons, make freaky alien lemonade.
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But Souls are delicious. They're like bacon - they taste good on anything. But if you eat them, you completely remove them from existence! They can't move on or... or be reincarnated! Huh. I never really gave it much thought. Besides, what do you mean by reincarnation anyway? You know, being reborn as someone or something else. Which means different body, different memories, different experiences, yes? So isn't being reborn as "something else" the same as being "removed from existence"? I... I... eating souls isn't right! That depends on your definition of "right". All living things survive by eating other living things. So what? You're a god. You should be above all that! Gods are above living things, which doesn't necessarily mean we care about them.
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You are being shagged... by a flightless parrot.
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Abacaba
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Jun 18 2018, 10:33 PM
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I agree. From a perspective originating in math, a cladistics is simpler than a ranked cladistics. Adding ranks doesn't tell you anything new about the life in question.
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Sheather
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Jun 18 2018, 11:01 PM
Post #20
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Ranks are good to classify animals in casual reference, like to say dogs are a species of the Canis genus in the Canid family, rather than saying that dogs are a type of Canis which are a type of Canid.
Ranks are arbitrary and are useful for our purposes but cannot be used taxonomically to anything but an arbitrary degree. Every individual animal in a species is unique to some extent and so the only way ranks could really work was if we called every single animal its own species - an impossible feat. We can only categorize broad groups of a given type of organism which are mostly similar and which mostly breed together as a species, and this works most of the time. Eventually populations evolve to the point they don't readily breed together and we call them a new species. But there is no point from A to B where you can draw that line. Tigers and lions today don't coexist with their common ancestor and so we can easily say they are two species. But what if tigers lived in India, Lions lived in Africa, and in between there was a cline of big cats varying from mostly lion to mostly tiger? You couldn't easily divide that population. There are living animals like this today and it makes the whole linnaean thing really difficult to work with.
There are also animals which look different enough, don't meet much in the wild and so are supposedly different species - but which breed together freely when they do meet without any fertility loss, like polar and grizzly bears. When we categorized those two species, they never seemed to mate in the wild. Now as the arctic warms, they come into contact and breed together. If we just landed on Earth today and discovered these two bears and saw how they interact, we'd consider them one varied species.
Linnean taxonomy also features such things as fish and reptile, which refer to animals of a general type but not necessarily any close relation. It's alright to call a crocodile and a lizard reptiles in general conversation because they are similarly adapted. But taxonomically, a crocodile is of course closer to a bird. While I feel all of the levels of this method of classification can be used to refer to clades, it requires some be changed so that birds are reptiles, and technically all land animals are fish. And even then, they will always be arbitrary. We can fit general groups of life into tiers - a family, comprising genera, comprising species - but exactly where one genus turns to another is ultimately what the person decides. Life is a continuum, not a series of distinct steps where an animal suddenly becomes something new in one generation. We want to fit life into neat little boxes, but that isn't how life is meant to be.
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A Wholesome and Good Thing
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LittleLazyLass
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Jun 18 2018, 11:16 PM
Post #21
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Proud quilt in a bag
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The one nice thing with Linnaean is the more uniform suffixes that come with the ranks, whereas cladistics gets you the mess of arbitrary, poorly-thought out names clades like Mammalia have become full with.
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totally not British, b-baka!
You like me (Unlike) I don't even really like this song that much but the title is pretty relatable sometimes, I guess.
Me  Forum user Uncanny Gemstar drew what is supposed to be a me. Thanks! Spoiler: click to toggle As they walk in, they're greeted by a small, poorly kept pathway leading to a poorly constructed Japanese-style gate. Behind this, a small field made up of corn, rice, wheat, potatoes, among other plants is contrasted by large piles of books, as well as a few rather out of place looking laptops. Off in the corner, a small woman, with long, striped, and strikingly colorful socks, no shoes, unremarkable denim shorts, a large, fancy black coat, arm warmers, glasses, a tuque, and somewhat unkempt, mid-length blue-and-pink-streaked red hair, is rummaging through a trash bin, located behind a sign saying "employees only". She continues this for a while (walking behind a wall to change her outfit now and then), until one of her visitors coughs. Startled, she looks up, apologizes, and grabs a handful of textbooks and novels before daintily running off to join them. What, you want me to tell you what these mean? Predenterra The (Lost) Lost World The Standing World Read First Clarifications on my sex and genderSorry if I come off as rude, I don't put much thought into word choice sometimes. I'm also super prone to editing my posts, sometimes multiple times, in the minutes following posting. For the love of god, take my posts from my earlier days on the forum with a grain of salt. I was not particularly knowledgeable or mature back then. Some of them are so cringe-worthy I can't even bring myself to look at them. Words Maybe Great Words - Words To Spec By
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It would have to be something extremely alien, pushing the limits of our imagination. But those are always my favorite kinds of life. ~~The Words of The Xenologist
- Words To Live By
-
Ignorance is never insulting if you're willing to learn, we're all ignorant about most things. ~~The Words of Lamna
- Words I Live By
-
Yeah, and even if you don't agree with creationists on that concept, that doesn't mean they can't be decent people. I have friends who are creationist (possibly even young earth) that I get along with fine in general life. I don't think they're right of course, but that doesn't make them intellectual degenerates. ~~The Words of forbidden3
Member Quotes - jman123
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Ass-breathing fish-lizards? Sounds like a punk rock band
- Sheather
-
"Holy fucking shit a toilet paper roll! Our favorite thing!"
- Urufumarukai
-
Tyrannosaurus aquastronka
- Kamineigh
-
Myo, if you don't stop reading the YouTube comments...
- Lamna
-
Are you saying what I think you're saying?
Sheather bathes in cum?
- Cephylus
-
And last night I dreamed I was blowing up a Kindergarten with a grenade launcher for no particular reason...
- revin
-
Oh, and of course more people get killed by selfies than by sharks. Of course.
- Parasky
-
SHEEEEAAAAATTTTTTHHHHHHHHHEEEEEEEEERRRRRRRRR!!!!!!!!
- whachamacalit2
-
The smell of rotting flesh really kills my appetite, surprising, but the visual appearance of corpses makes me hungry. Is that weird?
- Ebervalius
-
I mean, let us say I'm a genderfluid blurflux demi-romantic woman who is sexually attracted to men, but only if they are Melanesian and have a voice like that of Nicholas Cage. Okay, so what?
- trex841
-
When I first saw that picture, I thought you were dissecting a condom.
- Mr Mysterio
-
All hail Robo-Stalin.
- Peashyjah
-
Seems like everything in this project is now dead.
- Stealth Rock
-
Seagulls are pretty much trees, right?
- Watcher
-
We all must finish chapters of our lives to go on to the next. Sometime this means leaving behind versions of ourselves that don't want to die.
- Yiqi15
-
For April fool's, we had to make an orgasm that resembled a human foot.
- Flisch
-
im the black market
- CaledonianWarrior96
-
He was a skater birb, she said tweet you later birb
- Most People at Some Point
-
Quotes - Some dude called plucas1 from Youtube comments
-
Funny, isn't it, that our world needs Clark Kent a lot more than Superman.
- Xenoblade Chronicles
-
Even though he is our creator, that does not afford him the right to take our lives on a whim. But that is the thinking of a homs. He is a god. Such morals cannot apply to gods. So you think we should just shut up and die?! If that is the fate decided by a god. You are mistaken if you think we will simply accept such a fate and wait to die. We'll never stop fighting. Not till the end. To Zanza, the outcome is the same. Thus your logic is flawed.
- Hades - Kid Icarus Uprising
-
When freaky aliens give you lemons, make freaky alien lemonade.
- Kid Icarus Uprising
-
But Souls are delicious. They're like bacon - they taste good on anything. But if you eat them, you completely remove them from existence! They can't move on or... or be reincarnated! Huh. I never really gave it much thought. Besides, what do you mean by reincarnation anyway? You know, being reborn as someone or something else. Which means different body, different memories, different experiences, yes? So isn't being reborn as "something else" the same as being "removed from existence"? I... I... eating souls isn't right! That depends on your definition of "right". All living things survive by eating other living things. So what? You're a god. You should be above all that! Gods are above living things, which doesn't necessarily mean we care about them.
- Some Dude on BBC Two
-
You are being shagged... by a flightless parrot.
Stuff
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IIGSY
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Jun 18 2018, 11:37 PM
Post #22
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A huntsman spider that wastes time on the internet because it has nothing better to do
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- LittleBirthdayGirl!
- Jun 18 2018, 11:16 PM
The one nice thing with Linnaean is the more uniform suffixes that come with the ranks, whereas cladistics gets you the mess of arbitrary, poorly-thought out names clades like Mammalia have become full with. What do you mean by that?
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Projects Punga: A terraformed world with no vertebrates Last one crawling: The last arthropod
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"Considering the lifespans of modern non- insect arthropods (decade-old old millipedes, 50 year old tarantulas, 100+ year old lobsters) I wouldn't be surprised if Arthropleura had a lifespan exceeding that of a large testudine"-HangingTheif
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Then eat arby's and embrace the void."-Kamineigh
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Phylogeny of the arthropods and some related groups
In honor of the greatest clade of all time
More pictures
Other cool things
All African countries can fit into Brazil
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Ivan_The_Inedible
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Jun 19 2018, 12:16 AM
Post #23
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There are some who call me... Spencer.
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- IIGSY
- Jun 18 2018, 11:37 PM
- LittleBirthdayGirl!
- Jun 18 2018, 11:16 PM
The one nice thing with Linnaean is the more uniform suffixes that come with the ranks, whereas cladistics gets you the mess of arbitrary, poorly-thought out names clades like Mammalia have become full with.
What do you mean by that? Consider the following: Theriformes, Holotheria, Trechnotheria, Cladotheria, and Zatheria. All are clades that are basically marsupials and placentals and the next closest relation. Most notable things you get before reaching the split from monotremes at Theriiformes are the dryolestoids and the allotheres.
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Quotes are a thing I count myself as British when it suits me. -Ddraig Goch A magical beast that shits lightning in the name of the Warsaw Pact. -Kamineigh My friend was about to date this girl and then found out she was his second cousin. -Jasonguppy In its 4,600 year history, men from all eras, places and classes have been entering into the Library: from the ancient bearded sages of Sumeria and Chaldea, to the sober-minded Academics and Zoologists of the Victorian era, to the great warlord Cletus, an inbred hillbilly who just happened to be carrying his AR-15 around his County's Strip-Mall library. -Flashman63 Don't underestimate dials sexual advice, if you do get with her, it will be a lot easier than finding Japanese for blowjob. -Seascorpion I once dreamed I was trying to steal a flamingo. The flamingo was oddly calm about the whole situation. -Velociraptor It's just one species( Homo sapiens) on one little planet that I don't get along with... -Russwallac WITH OR WITHOUT NUTS? -Kamineigh Somewhere in heaven, a very groggy, very confused angel has just woken up and is trying to figure out why a boisterous Australian man is poking it with a stick. -Zihuatanejo Wait...you didn't urinate today did you? -Lamna Everybody knows people are 100% gay and anyone who claims not to be is in the closet. -Colddigger I regret everything I ever did and said. Ever. -KomradeWatcher Clearly, you have to start with the element that doesn't have any protons at all. -Kamineigh I will refer to her as Shelob, and hope she doesn't eat Fred. -Monster An Admantus has multiple forms, one of which is a derived hoatzin, or a floating cetacean. -OlympianMaster Soup is the spawn of Satan. -OlympianMaster Gosh you guys, 12 is the age for coke, not smokes. -Colddigger Why has Trex841 forsaken us? -Sheather I'll hit you in the armpit if you change your avatar. -Lamna And this is what the big one calls a 'camera'. Do smile politely, Alex. -Sheather's birb You are dunked in the vat of reverse-aging goo until you fit the criteria. -Holben the Popshroom is something of a counterpart to Nitwhite's endlessly ascending murderpigeons. -Sayornis And then a tree grew out of my desk. -Malicious Monkey All hail robo-Stalin. -Mr. Mysterio The greater risk involved in getting greater-cat droppings might also, in itself, make them more valued. -Sayornis Honestly Livyatan was worse than Parasky. -The Heretic Flisch. - Quote:
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Old Guard have powers? -Dr. Nitwhite The same that crotchety old people do. Age. -Ivan_The_Inedible
You know extra limbs, the epitome of fashion. -Stealth Rock You'd totally screw people up if you somehow shortened or lengthened their arms. -Flisch - Quote:
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Are you sure it's not just an eldritch wang? -Stealth_Rock 9 times out of 10, it usually is just an eldritch wang. -Mr. Mysterio
- How many birthdays do you even HAVE?!
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Well is it your UnBirthday! -Ivan_The_Inedible No... in a couple of months, however. -Dapper Man
Glarn, don't fuck the cave baboons. -Mr. Mysterio ANswer to every question thrown at you: crush a town with a burning meteor. -thatdudeun0 Oh, come on, I knew I should have gone with the pedophiles! -Trex841 You said fucking wot about Duecideye? -Dr. Nitwhite Therefore, hell and heaven must both be filled with camels. -Sphenodon What the fuck is an isopod doing in Hawaii? -Glarnboudin Fun fact: Whenever you learn something new, you are slowly approaching omniscience. -Flisch Specula existed as a top secret military project, that resulted in the creation of such beings as Lamna and Parasky, who were to be used in the war against Ba Sing Se. Eventually though, they ended up created Fakey, and they attempted to terminate it. Livyatan made the mistake of trying to save it, and he released the experiments from their containment, giving rise to the forum as we know it today. -Komrade Watcher We will not have fun here! We are talking about the scientific viability of adorable monsters that you keep in balls and use to fight other 10-year-olds' monsters for money and glory! THIS IS SEWIOUS -Glarnboudin I'd have mixed feelings about killing Parasky. -Hangingthief. They won that game, btw, as foretold by the ALL SEEING BIRD. -CanidaeSkull from tumblr Join with us, in the Illumi-Spec-y. -Ivan_The_Inedible I need him for totally legal things. Definitley not mass-cloning. -Ivan_The_Inedible Is normal a good word to describe any of us? -Dragon Who will know? Truly a god of abject pain and suffering. ESPECIALLY after what Parasky did to him. In case of Spec-destroying emergency, post in the enclosed thread.
My Projects
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LittleLazyLass
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Jun 19 2018, 12:27 AM
Post #24
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Proud quilt in a bag
- Posts:
- 8,633
- Group:
- Global Mods
- Member
- #1,463
- Joined:
- Jun 18, 2014
- Area of expertise:
- Alternate Universes
- Nationality:
- Sorry, but why do you want to know aboot my nationality, eh? Uh... sorry, that was rude of me. Sorry.
- Favorite Quote:
- "you know you're a nerd when you search Wookieepedia for porn"
- Also known as:
- You can call me Little; full list of old names found through profile.
- Gender:
- Trans Questioning (see link in sig; feminine pronouns)
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Oh, that doesn't bother me, those are important. I was referring to shit like Euarchonta (a dumb replacement of Archonta), Cetartiodactyla (a dumb replacement of Artiodactyla), the horrible Cetancodontamorpha/Whippomorpha mess (the former is the larger group that includes the latter, the crown, unfortunately not called Cetancodonta), and all the various and increasingly dumb names for competing hypotheses. Like, we've got Scrotifera, naming a bunch of laurasiatheres after having scrotums (yep...), perhaps containing Ferungulata, one of multiple terrible "just smash two names together" names (see also Euarchontaglires), or contrarily containing Zooamata, which literally means "animal friends".
All of names are various levels of dumb etymologically and none fit together in any nice sort of way. Pterosauria has a similar problem. In one glaring example, for one theory of pterosaur classification, someone coined "Neopterodactyloidea" for a group of derived azdarchoids (which contains a Tapejaromorpha and Dsungaripteromorpha), the latter group itself part of Ornithocheiroidea, Pterodactyloidea, and Novialoidea, in successive order... and that last one doesn't even have a root taxon! It can seem dumb naming a family and order for every species of bird, even the monotypic ones, but it really does go a long way in having good and understandable structure (bird clade names are usually decent, with some big misses now and then - how about Otididae within Otidae?).
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totally not British, b-baka!
You like me (Unlike) I don't even really like this song that much but the title is pretty relatable sometimes, I guess.
Me  Forum user Uncanny Gemstar drew what is supposed to be a me. Thanks! Spoiler: click to toggle As they walk in, they're greeted by a small, poorly kept pathway leading to a poorly constructed Japanese-style gate. Behind this, a small field made up of corn, rice, wheat, potatoes, among other plants is contrasted by large piles of books, as well as a few rather out of place looking laptops. Off in the corner, a small woman, with long, striped, and strikingly colorful socks, no shoes, unremarkable denim shorts, a large, fancy black coat, arm warmers, glasses, a tuque, and somewhat unkempt, mid-length blue-and-pink-streaked red hair, is rummaging through a trash bin, located behind a sign saying "employees only". She continues this for a while (walking behind a wall to change her outfit now and then), until one of her visitors coughs. Startled, she looks up, apologizes, and grabs a handful of textbooks and novels before daintily running off to join them. What, you want me to tell you what these mean? Predenterra The (Lost) Lost World The Standing World Read First Clarifications on my sex and genderSorry if I come off as rude, I don't put much thought into word choice sometimes. I'm also super prone to editing my posts, sometimes multiple times, in the minutes following posting. For the love of god, take my posts from my earlier days on the forum with a grain of salt. I was not particularly knowledgeable or mature back then. Some of them are so cringe-worthy I can't even bring myself to look at them. Words Maybe Great Words - Words To Spec By
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It would have to be something extremely alien, pushing the limits of our imagination. But those are always my favorite kinds of life. ~~The Words of The Xenologist
- Words To Live By
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Ignorance is never insulting if you're willing to learn, we're all ignorant about most things. ~~The Words of Lamna
- Words I Live By
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Yeah, and even if you don't agree with creationists on that concept, that doesn't mean they can't be decent people. I have friends who are creationist (possibly even young earth) that I get along with fine in general life. I don't think they're right of course, but that doesn't make them intellectual degenerates. ~~The Words of forbidden3
Member Quotes - jman123
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Ass-breathing fish-lizards? Sounds like a punk rock band
- Sheather
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"Holy fucking shit a toilet paper roll! Our favorite thing!"
- Urufumarukai
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Tyrannosaurus aquastronka
- Kamineigh
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Myo, if you don't stop reading the YouTube comments...
- Lamna
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Are you saying what I think you're saying?
Sheather bathes in cum?
- Cephylus
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And last night I dreamed I was blowing up a Kindergarten with a grenade launcher for no particular reason...
- revin
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Oh, and of course more people get killed by selfies than by sharks. Of course.
- Parasky
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SHEEEEAAAAATTTTTTHHHHHHHHHEEEEEEEEERRRRRRRRR!!!!!!!!
- whachamacalit2
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The smell of rotting flesh really kills my appetite, surprising, but the visual appearance of corpses makes me hungry. Is that weird?
- Ebervalius
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I mean, let us say I'm a genderfluid blurflux demi-romantic woman who is sexually attracted to men, but only if they are Melanesian and have a voice like that of Nicholas Cage. Okay, so what?
- trex841
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When I first saw that picture, I thought you were dissecting a condom.
- Mr Mysterio
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All hail Robo-Stalin.
- Peashyjah
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Seems like everything in this project is now dead.
- Stealth Rock
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Seagulls are pretty much trees, right?
- Watcher
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We all must finish chapters of our lives to go on to the next. Sometime this means leaving behind versions of ourselves that don't want to die.
- Yiqi15
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For April fool's, we had to make an orgasm that resembled a human foot.
- Flisch
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im the black market
- CaledonianWarrior96
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He was a skater birb, she said tweet you later birb
- Most People at Some Point
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Quotes - Some dude called plucas1 from Youtube comments
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Funny, isn't it, that our world needs Clark Kent a lot more than Superman.
- Xenoblade Chronicles
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Even though he is our creator, that does not afford him the right to take our lives on a whim. But that is the thinking of a homs. He is a god. Such morals cannot apply to gods. So you think we should just shut up and die?! If that is the fate decided by a god. You are mistaken if you think we will simply accept such a fate and wait to die. We'll never stop fighting. Not till the end. To Zanza, the outcome is the same. Thus your logic is flawed.
- Hades - Kid Icarus Uprising
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When freaky aliens give you lemons, make freaky alien lemonade.
- Kid Icarus Uprising
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But Souls are delicious. They're like bacon - they taste good on anything. But if you eat them, you completely remove them from existence! They can't move on or... or be reincarnated! Huh. I never really gave it much thought. Besides, what do you mean by reincarnation anyway? You know, being reborn as someone or something else. Which means different body, different memories, different experiences, yes? So isn't being reborn as "something else" the same as being "removed from existence"? I... I... eating souls isn't right! That depends on your definition of "right". All living things survive by eating other living things. So what? You're a god. You should be above all that! Gods are above living things, which doesn't necessarily mean we care about them.
- Some Dude on BBC Two
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You are being shagged... by a flightless parrot.
Stuff
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Archeoraptor
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Jun 19 2018, 05:17 AM
Post #25
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- Posts:
- 1,102
- Group:
- Members
- Member
- #1,356
- Joined:
- Mar 1, 2014
- Gender:
- Private
- Nationality:
- Español especulativo
- Favorite Quote:
- "god knows you will finally see,scars will heal but were meant to bleed
- Also known as:
- Archeo or that guy who misspells
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- Sheather
- Jun 18 2018, 11:01 PM
But what if tigers lived in India, Lions lived in Africa, and in between there was a cline of big cats varying from mostly lion to mostly tiger? You couldn't easily divide that population. There are living animals like this today and it makes the whole linnaean thing really difficult to work with.
There are also animals which look different enough, don't meet much in the wild and so are supposedly different species - but which breed together freely when they do meet without any fertility loss, like polar and grizzly bears. When we categorized those two species, they never seemed to mate in the wild. Now as the arctic warms, they come into contact and breed together. If we just landed on Earth today and discovered these two bears and saw how they interact, we'd consider them one varied species.
that is why I Said genius is more stable than species, though not sure right now but basically the definition of species is not a sharp like as some may think, i mean nothing in nature is purely sharp0 lines
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Astarte an alt eocene world,now on long hiatus but you never know Fanauraa; The rebirth of Aotearoa future evo set in new zealand after a mass extinction coming soon......a world that was seeded with earth´s weridest and who knows what is coming next...........
" I have to know what the world will be looking throw a future beyond us I have to know what could have been if fate acted in another way I have to know what lies on the unknown universe I have to know that the laws of thee universe can be broken throw The Spec I gain strength to the inner peace the is not good of evil only nature and change,the evolution of all livings beings" "
Spoiler: click to toggle coming soon......a world seeded by outcast clades and some important easily forgotten ones.the world of the caecilians and company and who knows what is coming next...........[comming soon/spoiler] Spoiler: click to toggle Did you ever hear the tragedy of Darth Lyvatan The Wise? I thought not. It’s not a story the newbies would tell you. It’s a forum legend. Lyvatan was an admin of the forum, so powerful and so wise he could use science to influence the human imagination to create life… He had such a knowledge of the forum that he could even keep the ones he cared about from leaving.Speculative Evolution is a pathway to many abilities some consider to be unnatural. He became so powerful… the only thing he was afraid of was losing his admin power, which eventually, of course, he did. Unfortunately, he taught his apprentice everything he knew, then his apprentice banned him while he was offline. Ironic. He could save others from leaving the community, but not himself.
Speccer´s Quotes "The moral of the story: never trust a catfish"-Bettleboy
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Zoologist
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Jun 19 2018, 12:53 PM
Post #26
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- Posts:
- 26
- Group:
- Members
- Member
- #2,173
- Joined:
- Jun 16, 2017
- Gender:
- Male
- Area of expertise:
- Alternate Evolution
- Nationality:
- United States
- Favorite Quote:
- "In the absence of proper data, speculate wildly" -Mark Witton
- Also known as:
- Luke
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Linnaean classification really doesn’t have uniform suffixes. The only rank that has a required format is the family rank, and even that differs in different groups. For example, in animals it ends in -idae and in plants it ends in -aceae. While it’s true that some groups, like birds, have orders that all end in the same suffix, that doesn’t have to be the case, just look at mammalian and retilian orders.
The Linnaean classification system is still useful when only extant or modern biological systems are being discussed, for example in conservation. But if you are looking at anything from an evolutionary biology perspective, Linnaean classification just isn’t useful. There’s no point to assigning ranks when there is a nearly unlimited number of theoretically possible clades in existence. However, the idea of a species can still be useful because it is the smallest useful group in evolutionary biology. And we have to categorize life into some sort of system to be able to study it at all. Species are just the best way to do that, at least for now. And I seriously doubt we’ll ever abandon the concept of species, because that would just be a huge problem converting everything we know into whatever new system someone could come up with.
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That wonderful point where you've learned so much that you can't remember half of it
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LittleLazyLass
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Jun 19 2018, 01:04 PM
Post #27
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Proud quilt in a bag
- Posts:
- 8,633
- Group:
- Global Mods
- Member
- #1,463
- Joined:
- Jun 18, 2014
- Area of expertise:
- Alternate Universes
- Nationality:
- Sorry, but why do you want to know aboot my nationality, eh? Uh... sorry, that was rude of me. Sorry.
- Favorite Quote:
- "you know you're a nerd when you search Wookieepedia for porn"
- Also known as:
- You can call me Little; full list of old names found through profile.
- Gender:
- Trans Questioning (see link in sig; feminine pronouns)
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- Quote:
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Linnaean classification really doesn’t have uniform suffixes. The only rank that has a required format is the family rank, and even that differs in different groups. For example, in animals it ends in -idae and in plants it ends in -aceae. While it’s true that some groups, like birds, have orders that all end in the same suffix, that doesn’t have to be the case, just look at mammalian and retilian orders. Of course, but even the enforcement of -ini, -inae, -idea, -oidea goes a long way in making things easy to understand. You see a name, you have a rough idea how big of a concept it is. Compared to stacking the same suffix like in my pterosaur example, or including completely unrelated names in the middle of it all, like Pachyrostra or Eucentrosaura in Ceratopsidae.
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totally not British, b-baka!
You like me (Unlike) I don't even really like this song that much but the title is pretty relatable sometimes, I guess.
Me  Forum user Uncanny Gemstar drew what is supposed to be a me. Thanks! Spoiler: click to toggle As they walk in, they're greeted by a small, poorly kept pathway leading to a poorly constructed Japanese-style gate. Behind this, a small field made up of corn, rice, wheat, potatoes, among other plants is contrasted by large piles of books, as well as a few rather out of place looking laptops. Off in the corner, a small woman, with long, striped, and strikingly colorful socks, no shoes, unremarkable denim shorts, a large, fancy black coat, arm warmers, glasses, a tuque, and somewhat unkempt, mid-length blue-and-pink-streaked red hair, is rummaging through a trash bin, located behind a sign saying "employees only". She continues this for a while (walking behind a wall to change her outfit now and then), until one of her visitors coughs. Startled, she looks up, apologizes, and grabs a handful of textbooks and novels before daintily running off to join them. What, you want me to tell you what these mean? Predenterra The (Lost) Lost World The Standing World Read First Clarifications on my sex and genderSorry if I come off as rude, I don't put much thought into word choice sometimes. I'm also super prone to editing my posts, sometimes multiple times, in the minutes following posting. For the love of god, take my posts from my earlier days on the forum with a grain of salt. I was not particularly knowledgeable or mature back then. Some of them are so cringe-worthy I can't even bring myself to look at them. Words Maybe Great Words - Words To Spec By
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It would have to be something extremely alien, pushing the limits of our imagination. But those are always my favorite kinds of life. ~~The Words of The Xenologist
- Words To Live By
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Ignorance is never insulting if you're willing to learn, we're all ignorant about most things. ~~The Words of Lamna
- Words I Live By
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Yeah, and even if you don't agree with creationists on that concept, that doesn't mean they can't be decent people. I have friends who are creationist (possibly even young earth) that I get along with fine in general life. I don't think they're right of course, but that doesn't make them intellectual degenerates. ~~The Words of forbidden3
Member Quotes - jman123
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Ass-breathing fish-lizards? Sounds like a punk rock band
- Sheather
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"Holy fucking shit a toilet paper roll! Our favorite thing!"
- Urufumarukai
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Tyrannosaurus aquastronka
- Kamineigh
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Myo, if you don't stop reading the YouTube comments...
- Lamna
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Are you saying what I think you're saying?
Sheather bathes in cum?
- Cephylus
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And last night I dreamed I was blowing up a Kindergarten with a grenade launcher for no particular reason...
- revin
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Oh, and of course more people get killed by selfies than by sharks. Of course.
- Parasky
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SHEEEEAAAAATTTTTTHHHHHHHHHEEEEEEEEERRRRRRRRR!!!!!!!!
- whachamacalit2
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The smell of rotting flesh really kills my appetite, surprising, but the visual appearance of corpses makes me hungry. Is that weird?
- Ebervalius
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I mean, let us say I'm a genderfluid blurflux demi-romantic woman who is sexually attracted to men, but only if they are Melanesian and have a voice like that of Nicholas Cage. Okay, so what?
- trex841
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When I first saw that picture, I thought you were dissecting a condom.
- Mr Mysterio
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All hail Robo-Stalin.
- Peashyjah
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Seems like everything in this project is now dead.
- Stealth Rock
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Seagulls are pretty much trees, right?
- Watcher
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We all must finish chapters of our lives to go on to the next. Sometime this means leaving behind versions of ourselves that don't want to die.
- Yiqi15
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For April fool's, we had to make an orgasm that resembled a human foot.
- Flisch
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im the black market
- CaledonianWarrior96
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He was a skater birb, she said tweet you later birb
- Most People at Some Point
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Quotes - Some dude called plucas1 from Youtube comments
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Funny, isn't it, that our world needs Clark Kent a lot more than Superman.
- Xenoblade Chronicles
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Even though he is our creator, that does not afford him the right to take our lives on a whim. But that is the thinking of a homs. He is a god. Such morals cannot apply to gods. So you think we should just shut up and die?! If that is the fate decided by a god. You are mistaken if you think we will simply accept such a fate and wait to die. We'll never stop fighting. Not till the end. To Zanza, the outcome is the same. Thus your logic is flawed.
- Hades - Kid Icarus Uprising
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When freaky aliens give you lemons, make freaky alien lemonade.
- Kid Icarus Uprising
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But Souls are delicious. They're like bacon - they taste good on anything. But if you eat them, you completely remove them from existence! They can't move on or... or be reincarnated! Huh. I never really gave it much thought. Besides, what do you mean by reincarnation anyway? You know, being reborn as someone or something else. Which means different body, different memories, different experiences, yes? So isn't being reborn as "something else" the same as being "removed from existence"? I... I... eating souls isn't right! That depends on your definition of "right". All living things survive by eating other living things. So what? You're a god. You should be above all that! Gods are above living things, which doesn't necessarily mean we care about them.
- Some Dude on BBC Two
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You are being shagged... by a flightless parrot.
Stuff
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IIGSY
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Jun 19 2018, 06:36 PM
Post #28
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A huntsman spider that wastes time on the internet because it has nothing better to do
- Posts:
- 3,758
- Group:
- Members
- Member
- #1,987
- Joined:
- Sep 11, 2016
- Gender:
- Male
- Area of expertise:
- Future Evolution
- Favorite Quote:
- Don't have one
- Also known as:
- Anomonys
- Gender:
- male
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- LittleLazyLass
- Jun 19 2018, 12:27 AM
Oh, that doesn't bother me, those are important. I was referring to shit like Euarchonta (a dumb replacement of Archonta), Cetartiodactyla (a dumb replacement of Artiodactyla), the horrible Cetancodontamorpha/Whippomorpha mess (the former is the larger group that includes the latter, the crown, unfortunately not called Cetancodonta), and all the various and increasingly dumb names for competing hypotheses. Like, we've got Scrotifera, naming a bunch of laurasiatheres after having scrotums (yep...), perhaps containing Ferungulata, one of multiple terrible "just smash two names together" names (see also Euarchontaglires), or contrarily containing Zooamata, which literally means "animal friends".
All of names are various levels of dumb etymologically and none fit together in any nice sort of way. Pterosauria has a similar problem. In one glaring example, for one theory of pterosaur classification, someone coined "Neopterodactyloidea" for a group of derived azdarchoids (which contains a Tapejaromorpha and Dsungaripteromorpha), the latter group itself part of Ornithocheiroidea, Pterodactyloidea, and Novialoidea, in successive order... and that last one doesn't even have a root taxon! It can seem dumb naming a family and order for every species of bird, even the monotypic ones, but it really does go a long way in having good and understandable structure (bird clade names are usually decent, with some big misses now and then - how about Otididae within Otidae?). I get where you are coming from with the mammals, but I don't get the issue with pterosaurs.
- Quote:
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Of course, but even the enforcement of -ini, -inae, -idea, -oidea goes a long way in making things easy to understand. You see a name, you have a rough idea how big of a concept it is. Compared to stacking the same suffix like in my pterosaur example, or including completely unrelated names in the middle of it all, like Pachyrostra or Eucentrosaura in Ceratopsidae.
Also, I don't see anyone complaining about the lack of uniformity of arachnid orders. They end in -gradi, -ones, -neae, -poda, and more.
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Projects Punga: A terraformed world with no vertebrates Last one crawling: The last arthropod
ARTH-6810: A world without vertebrates (It's ded, but you can still read I guess)
Potential ideas- Swamp world: A world covered in lakes, with the largest being caspian sized. Nematozoic: After a mass extinction of ultimate proportions, a single species of nematode is the only surviving animal. Tri-devonian: A devonian like ecosystem with holocene species on three different continents.
Quotes "Arthropod respiratory systems aren't really "inefficient", they're just better suited to their body size. It would be quite inefficient for a tiny creature that can easily get all the oxygen it needs through passive diffusion to have a respiratory system that wastes energy on muscles that pump air into sacs. (Hence why lungless salamanders, uniquely miniscule and hyperabundant tetrapods, have ditched their lungs in favor of breathing with their skin and buccal mucous membranes.) But large, active insects already use muscles to pump air in and out of their spiracles, and I don't see why their tracheae couldn't develop pseudo- lungs if other conditions pressured them to grow larger."-HangingTheif
"Considering the lifespans of modern non- insect arthropods (decade-old old millipedes, 50 year old tarantulas, 100+ year old lobsters) I wouldn't be surprised if Arthropleura had a lifespan exceeding that of a large testudine"-HangingTheif
"Humans have a tribal mindset and it's not alien for tribes to war on each other. I mean, look at the atrocities chimpanzee tribes do to each other. Most of people's groupings and big conflicts in history are directly or obliquely manifestations of this tribal mindset."-Sceynyos-yis
"He's the leader of the bunch You know his Coconut Gun is finally back to fire in spurts. His Coconut Gun Can make you smile If he shoots ya it's firing in spurts. His Coconut Gun Is bigger, faster, stronger too! He's the gun member of the Coconut Crew! HUH!
C.G.! Coconut Gun! C.G.! Co-Coconut Gun! Shoot yourself with a Coconut Gun! HUH!"-Kamineigh
"RIP, rest in Peytoia."-Little
"In Summary: Piss on Lovecraft's racist grave by making lewds of Cthulhu and Nyarlathotep.
Then eat arby's and embrace the void."-Kamineigh
"Dougal Dixon rule 34."-Sayornis
Phylogeny of the arthropods and some related groups
In honor of the greatest clade of all time
More pictures
Other cool things
All African countries can fit into Brazil
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LittleLazyLass
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Jun 19 2018, 07:44 PM
Post #29
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Proud quilt in a bag
- Posts:
- 8,633
- Group:
- Global Mods
- Member
- #1,463
- Joined:
- Jun 18, 2014
- Area of expertise:
- Alternate Universes
- Nationality:
- Sorry, but why do you want to know aboot my nationality, eh? Uh... sorry, that was rude of me. Sorry.
- Favorite Quote:
- "you know you're a nerd when you search Wookieepedia for porn"
- Also known as:
- You can call me Little; full list of old names found through profile.
- Gender:
- Trans Questioning (see link in sig; feminine pronouns)
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I get where you are coming from with the mammals, but I don't get the issue with pterosaurs. Well, it's just confusing. Under a more linnaean-inspired scheme, an -oidea ending would indicate a superfamily, or an equivalent clade. If you see an -idae, it's gonna be within that, if you see -iformes it's probably higher and -morpha is higher than that. But once you start stacking that same suffix and putting them anywhere, that assumption works against you, and the suffix tells you nothing. Taking the Novialoidea example, you'd also expect there to be an associated "Novialus" or something within it, but there's not. Then you get completely random, hard to remember names like Breviquartossa, which leads into dumb etymologies like in the mammal example.
The lack of use of type genera for higher level names also hurts the system; again from the same Pterosauria classsification, we've got the group Ornithocheiroidea, and then Pteranodontoidea (even though this group still contains Ornithocheirus, so with traditional structure we'd stick with naming with it for simplicity), then Ornithocheiromorpha (inside two -oideas, and switching back on the nomical taxon, since Pteranodon is outside), then Lanceodontia (this isn't based on anything), then Anhangueria (switching taxa again, even though Ornithocheirus is in this one too), before finally switching back to Ornithocheirae. Although Linnaean doesn't govern past the family, the general practice of naming off a single root taxon would encourage something far more logical, like perhaps:
Ornithocheirae - Ornithocheiromorpha - Ornithocheiriformes - Ornithocheiria - Ornithocheiroidea - Euornithocheira
This naming scheme for the six clades above makes it really easy to look at this and say, oh, this is Ornithocheirus' branch on the tree; whereas when I see Pteranodontoidea within Ornithocheiroidea, I'm inclined to think the former doesn't include Ornithocheirus... but it does.
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Me  Forum user Uncanny Gemstar drew what is supposed to be a me. Thanks! Spoiler: click to toggle As they walk in, they're greeted by a small, poorly kept pathway leading to a poorly constructed Japanese-style gate. Behind this, a small field made up of corn, rice, wheat, potatoes, among other plants is contrasted by large piles of books, as well as a few rather out of place looking laptops. Off in the corner, a small woman, with long, striped, and strikingly colorful socks, no shoes, unremarkable denim shorts, a large, fancy black coat, arm warmers, glasses, a tuque, and somewhat unkempt, mid-length blue-and-pink-streaked red hair, is rummaging through a trash bin, located behind a sign saying "employees only". She continues this for a while (walking behind a wall to change her outfit now and then), until one of her visitors coughs. Startled, she looks up, apologizes, and grabs a handful of textbooks and novels before daintily running off to join them. What, you want me to tell you what these mean? Predenterra The (Lost) Lost World The Standing World Read First Clarifications on my sex and genderSorry if I come off as rude, I don't put much thought into word choice sometimes. I'm also super prone to editing my posts, sometimes multiple times, in the minutes following posting. For the love of god, take my posts from my earlier days on the forum with a grain of salt. I was not particularly knowledgeable or mature back then. Some of them are so cringe-worthy I can't even bring myself to look at them. Words Maybe Great Words - Words To Spec By
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Jun 19 2018, 07:54 PM
Post #30
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A huntsman spider that wastes time on the internet because it has nothing better to do
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- LittleLazyLass
- Jun 19 2018, 07:44 PM
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I get where you are coming from with the mammals, but I don't get the issue with pterosaurs.
Well, it's just confusing. Under a more linnaean-inspired scheme, an -oidea ending would indicate a superfamily, or an equivalent clade. If you see an -idae, it's gonna be within that, if you see -iformes it's probably higher and -morpha is higher than that. But once you start stacking that same suffix and putting them anywhere, that assumption works against you, and the suffix tells you nothing. Taking the Novialoidea example, you'd also expect there to be an associated "Novialus" or something within it, but there's not. Then you get completely random, hard to remember names like Breviquartossa, which leads into dumb etymologies like in the mammal example. The lack of use of type genera for higher level names also hurts the system; again from the same Pterosauria classsification, we've got the group Ornithocheiroidea, and then Pteranodontoidea (even though this group still contains Ornithocheirus, so with traditional structure we'd stick with naming with it for simplicity), then Ornithocheiromorpha (inside two -oideas, and switching back on the nomical taxon, since Pteranodon is outside), then Lanceodontia (this isn't based on anything), then Anhangueria (switching taxa again, even though Ornithocheirus is in this one too), before finally switching back to Ornithocheirae. Although Linnaean doesn't govern past the family, the general practice of naming off a single root taxon would encourage something far more logical, like perhaps: Ornithocheirae - Ornithocheiromorpha - Ornithocheiriformes - Ornithocheiria - Ornithocheiroidea - Euornithocheira This naming scheme for the six clades above makes it really easy to look at this and say, oh, this is Ornithocheirus' branch on the tree; whereas when I see Pteranodontoidea within Ornithocheiroidea, I'm inclined to think the former doesn't include Ornithocheirus... but it does. So, what you're saying is the lack of consistency for suffixes and prefixes? I get it now, but it still seems that many groups like arachnids have no internal consistency but aren't causing any problems.
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Projects Punga: A terraformed world with no vertebrates Last one crawling: The last arthropod
ARTH-6810: A world without vertebrates (It's ded, but you can still read I guess)
Potential ideas- Swamp world: A world covered in lakes, with the largest being caspian sized. Nematozoic: After a mass extinction of ultimate proportions, a single species of nematode is the only surviving animal. Tri-devonian: A devonian like ecosystem with holocene species on three different continents.
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Then eat arby's and embrace the void."-Kamineigh
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Phylogeny of the arthropods and some related groups
In honor of the greatest clade of all time
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Other cool things
All African countries can fit into Brazil
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