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Taming animal traditionally untamable
Topic Started: Sep 28 2017, 06:38 PM (550 Views)
Greg the Mark Sestero
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Oh hey spec hey forum, whats up!

I've been wondering for the past couple of week whether or not its possible is it to tame an animal that is not traditionally tamable i. e rhinos , large crocodiles and sharks and even non avian dinosaurs. I know this isn't conventional for the forum but hear me out. There have been some ideas I have been tossing around that seem semi plausible (and seem right up your alley) from what I can tell and they go in this order from least to most probably as so.

-Feeding the animal enough so it relates food with you to the point it no longer sees you as a threat and doesn't want to avoid you. This would be the least likely of the bunch but I wonder whats your take on it

-Knocking out the animal and attaching hooks on rope in strategic areas of the animal so that one could pull and essentially maneuver the animal while it runs away in pain and pull in he other direction so that it moves in that direction thus controlling the animal through pain.

-Feeding it some form of cordycep like fungus whether artificial or natural which would slowly eat the animals brain out and make it do whatever the fungus tells it to and modifying said fungus to say whatever you want the animal to do.


I know this whole thing is a bit iffy bu I'm genuinely curious about the subject.

Also I would like to ask what did keep us or any other hypothetical intelligence from taming these sorts of animals in the first place? and is it even possible to tame these sorts of animals at all?
Edited by Greg the Mark Sestero, Sep 28 2017, 06:49 PM.
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Yiqi15
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Those methods are all probably going to get you charged with animal cruelty.
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Greg the Mark Sestero
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Yiqi15
Sep 28 2017, 07:08 PM
Those methods are all probably going to get you charged with animal cruelty.
Of course, but this is all hypothetical so no harm in asking. Anyway what do you think about the solutions I proposed?
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Fazaner
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Greg the Mark Sestero
Sep 28 2017, 06:38 PM
Oh hey spec hey forum, whats up!

I've been wondering for the past couple of week whether or not its possible is it to tame an animal that is not traditionally tamable i. e rhinos , large crocodiles and sharks and even non avian dinosaurs. I know this isn't conventional for the forum but hear me out. There have been some ideas I have been tossing around that seem semi plausible (and seem right up your alley) from what I can tell and they go in this order from least to most probably as so.

-Feeding the animal enough so it relates food with you to the point it no longer sees you as a threat and doesn't want to avoid you. This would be the least likely of the bunch but I wonder whats your take on it

-Knocking out the animal and attaching hooks on rope in strategic areas of the animal so that one could pull and essentially maneuver the animal while it runs away in pain and pull in he other direction so that it moves in that direction thus controlling the animal through pain.

-Feeding it some form of cordycep like fungus whether artificial or natural which would slowly eat the animals brain out and make it do whatever the fungus tells it to and modifying said fungus to say whatever you want the animal to do.


I know this whole thing is a bit iffy bu I'm genuinely curious about the subject.

Also I would like to ask what did keep us or any other hypothetical intelligence from taming these sorts of animals in the first place? and is it even possible to tame these sorts of animals at all?
I had similar ideas, so lets begun. Is this for a project or just a thought?

Method 1: This might seam a good idea, and will make animal unafraid om man, but it has a big side effect. You see once you start feeding them they will see you as a food dispenser, and if you came close without food animal may attack because of that. Carnivores are especially dangerous, here were reports of feral dogs attacking people, most likely because they used to get food in the past from them. So yeah, not a good idea in a long turn.

Method 2: OH HELL NO!!! Where have you got this idea from? It will only work while ropes hold. Best case scenario, animal brakes free and runs away, never to be seen again. Worst case scenario(and more probable one), animal brakes free, and repays the dept with interest.

Method 3: First, NOPE. Second, is it even possible?

Best way to tame a animal is to start from young age, so animal can see you as a authority. Of course this wont work on most animals, some have young taking care of themselves from birth, while some are just too wild.
Majority of modern domestic animals have some kind of hierarchy, or pecking order, and humans are at the top of it. And what do you consider for tame?

I think that some prehistoric animals could be tamed, mainly those that lived in herds and packs.

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Tommy Wiseau
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Oh HELL YES Method 2. Well first of all, it would work as long as the ropes or wires or whatever held right? Also wouldn't this method work the best in theory? I mean not all animals respond to social hierarchies, but a hell of a lot of them respond to pain. I mean couldn't you scuba up, knock up (whoops, knock OUT) a great white shark, the strap it up and ride into battle?
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HangingThief
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The method doesn't have to be one or the other. Animals can be trained with a mixture of positive and negative stimulus. Inflict pain when it does something bad, feed it when it does what you want it to. Color coded poles or similar devices can be used to give the animal something besides your body to directly associate each stimulus.

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Tommy Wiseau
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I don't really see that working on a shark or even reptiles, I can't really think of any examples of that sort of thing. Also I'm almost certain birds, for instance don't perform well with the whole "positive = bad stimulus" and "negative = bad stimulus".
Edited by Tommy Wiseau, Sep 30 2017, 07:26 PM.
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IIGSY
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hymenoptera_training

This is pretty relevant.

But, I wonder. Are solitary arthropods trainable? Or even cephalopods?
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Tommy Wiseau
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I don't know, that seems very limited form of "taming" if you could even call it that, I mean they can only detect a specific odor then move towards it based on what you presented, which isn't what I had in mind and probably isn't what Mark had in mind. I mean you can't really get anything else out of that, you wouldn't be able to ride a creature that way, or get it to move in a certain direction, or provoke an aggressive reaction.
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Greg the Mark Sestero
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Fazaner
Sep 30 2017, 05:28 AM
Greg the Mark Sestero
Sep 28 2017, 06:38 PM
Oh hey spec hey forum, whats up!

I've been wondering for the past couple of week whether or not its possible is it to tame an animal that is not traditionally tamable i. e rhinos , large crocodiles and sharks and even non avian dinosaurs. I know this isn't conventional for the forum but hear me out. There have been some ideas I have been tossing around that seem semi plausible (and seem right up your alley) from what I can tell and they go in this order from least to most probably as so.

-Feeding the animal enough so it relates food with you to the point it no longer sees you as a threat and doesn't want to avoid you. This would be the least likely of the bunch but I wonder whats your take on it

-Knocking out the animal and attaching hooks on rope in strategic areas of the animal so that one could pull and essentially maneuver the animal while it runs away in pain and pull in he other direction so that it moves in that direction thus controlling the animal through pain.

-Feeding it some form of cordycep like fungus whether artificial or natural which would slowly eat the animals brain out and make it do whatever the fungus tells it to and modifying said fungus to say whatever you want the animal to do.


I know this whole thing is a bit iffy bu I'm genuinely curious about the subject.

Also I would like to ask what did keep us or any other hypothetical intelligence from taming these sorts of animals in the first place? and is it even possible to tame these sorts of animals at all?
I had similar ideas, so lets begun. Is this for a project or just a thought?

Method 1: This might seam a good idea, and will make animal unafraid om man, but it has a big side effect. You see once you start feeding them they will see you as a food dispenser, and if you came close without food animal may attack because of that. Carnivores are especially dangerous, here were reports of feral dogs attacking people, most likely because they used to get food in the past from them. So yeah, not a good idea in a long turn.

Method 2: OH HELL NO!!! Where have you got this idea from? It will only work while ropes hold. Best case scenario, animal brakes free and runs away, never to be seen again. Worst case scenario(and more probable one), animal brakes free, and repays the dept with interest.

Method 3: First, NOPE. Second, is it even possible?

Best way to tame a animal is to start from young age, so animal can see you as a authority. Of course this wont work on most animals, some have young taking care of themselves from birth, while some are just too wild.
Majority of modern domestic animals have some kind of hierarchy, or pecking order, and humans are at the top of it. And what do you consider for tame?

I think that some prehistoric animals could be tamed, mainly those that lived in herds and packs.

Not exactly, more like a thought experiment I was tossing around when thinking of a scientifically feasible ark. But it could work well for one.


And as for method 3 I should probably elaborate. see in THEORY a species of cordycep like fungus could take over this animals brain and maybe some how you or someone/something else could genetically modify this cordycep like fungus to take over the animal to complete a certain task but, maybe this could be done through genetic manipulation or even good o'l selective breeding for example genetically modify a cordycep that makes it attack everything but you or a codycep that makes the animal follow a certain stimulus effectively letting you "carrot roping" it to anywhere you please. But I'm kinda skeptical myself and still don't know if its even possible and this isn't exactly taming as much as biological mind control so I guess I'll give you that one.

And as for what I consider for a tame is an animal that doesn't attack you and follow some basic orders and maybe even lets you ride it like an elephant.


Also I would like to know if its possible to make the animal follow an "attack command" of sorts I could see this being done by maybe teaching the animal to attack anything that's immediately in front of it and just approaching the intended target ,but I'm not sure.



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Rodlox
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Sep 30 2017, 07:58 PM
But, I wonder. Are solitary arthropods trainable? Or even cephalopods?
on an individual basis, yes, to both.

has anyone tried selecting for tamer and tamer individuals over generations? not that i know.
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Rodlox
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Greg the Mark Sestero
Sep 28 2017, 06:38 PM
Oh hey spec hey forum, whats up!

I've been wondering for the past couple of week whether or not its possible is it to tame an animal that is not traditionally tamable i. e rhinos , large crocodiles and sharks and even non avian dinosaurs. I know this isn't conventional for the forum but hear me out. There have been some ideas I have been tossing around that seem semi plausible (and seem right up your alley) from what I can tell and they go in this order from least to most probably as so.

-Feeding the animal enough so it relates food with you to the point it no longer sees you as a threat and doesn't want to avoid you. This would be the least likely of the bunch but I wonder whats your take on it
its possible to tame rhinos, sharks, crocs, and more...this happens in zoos and some game parks. i think you're thinking of domestication, yes? in which case its theoretically possible with crocs (nobody tried it, even when we were hauling their populations back from near the brink)...and rhinos and elephants have too long a lifespan to work.

to the feeding idea - this is why bears and deer attack people: they're looking for food on our persons.
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Fazaner
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Greg the Mark Sestero
Sep 30 2017, 08:30 PM
Open to read




I see now, so basically trained animal? In that case it is possible for many species. Zoos use that (just like Rodlox pointed out) to control animals trough reward system, like when moving animals they use this to avoid sedating them. In that way animal know that when they do something good they get rewarded with treat, and they dont get anything when they make mistake. Of course that wont be easy for dumb animals (may not be able to get commands properly) or real smart ones (monkeys or dolphins are known to make tricks for that).

And riding is debatable, it might let you to jump on the back and hold on,but most of the times you wont have any control.
As for combat, you could point pissed off rhino in general direction of target, but that's it. And that can get bad side effect, since even tame animals can be unpredictable, and turn in wrong direction, in fact that's how in ancient times armies countered war elephants, by scaring them off by fire or burning pigs (if you ever heard screaming pig you know what i am talking about), and frightened animals would run back trough it's own lines. Even domestic animals can be unpredictable in combat situations, horses were known get wild near explosions. Red army during WWII used anti-tank dogs (i am not making this up) to blow-up german tanks, and were trained to look for food under tanks and trucks. But in reality dogs often got confused and got under russian tanks, or they got scared and were running back into tranches. You can guess how this ended.
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-Galaxy on fire. They have left their home to get out of war. They had no idea what awaits them.

My Deviant art profile, if you're curious.
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bloom_boi
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I'm pretty sure anything with a brain is trainable and even things without brains. It's all about stimulus, behaviour then reward or punishment. The problem is resources, including time. Throw cash at a research team and they could probably figure out the details of rhino psychology and from that you just apply the stimulus>behaviour>reward/punishment to suppress or motivate certain actions till you have a tamed animal.
Now whether that tamed animal would be healthy is uncertain. My guess is that it wouldn't be, though you can keep throwing cash at that research team until you find a method that tames but doesn't stress the animal out to premature death.

The soviets were interested in the idea of taming nature down to a point, I bet you already know of their domesticated fox programs, of which many still survive and breed but did you know of their moose cavarly experiment from the 1930s, which was canceled of course after the experiences of WWII put the final nail in the coffin of the whole concept of cavalry.

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