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Lulz, DC Comics
Topic Started: May 31 2012, 06:59 PM (1,456 Views)
Canis Lupis
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Dinosaurs eat man, woman inherits the Earth.

See, Fakey, I've got the opposite problem. It really gets my knickers in a knot when someone says they prefer DC to Marvel. Marvel has the best superheroes and is a more realistic interpretation of what would happen if people got superpowers.

Don't get me wrong. There are some Marvel heroes that absolutely suck (Ghost Rider, namely. Why do you exist??!!) but there are also quite a few DC superheroes that suck (namely Superman, Wonder Woman, and Aquaman).

I hate DC. I love Marvel. But I love Batman more than Marvel. Frankly, I think Batman and his villains are the best of all comics universes. He's the most realistic hero, his comics are sufficiently dark, and his villains are just fun to watch do bad (when I watch "The Dark Knight," I tend to skip through the Batman parts and just watch the Joker. Heath Ledger did a stellar job with him). Plus, Batman's villains actually present a challenge to him (for example, Bane (the main villain in "The Dark Knight Rises," in case you don't know) actually broke Batman's back in the "Knightfall" storyline).

However, none of the DC superheroes live up to Batman's example. Green Arrow almost does. But none of the rest do. Almost all the superheroes are way too powerful with way too specific weaknesses. Superman is the prime example. He has all the superpowers any kid could want all because he gets high off our yellow sun. It's ridiculous. Plus, he is only weakened by kryptonite. None of his villains, thus, present a challenge. Brainiac, Lex Luthor, Darkseid, and (worst of all) the Toymaker. Who the hell thought Superman and his villains were a good idea?

By contrast, Marvel heroes are sooo much better. The heroes don't just fight their villains (which, in some cases, are good (I can't stand Apocalypse from the "X-men" comics)); they also fight their own personal demons. Iron Man/Tony Stark has to spend as much time fighting his alcoholism as he does fighting Mandarin. The Hulk/Bruce Banner (my favorite Marvel hero) focuses as much on defeating his own self as he does fighting Abomination and the Leader. The X-men have to focus on fighting the anti-mutant sentiment almost as much as they have to fight Magneto (my favorite Marvel villain) and his cronies.

In short, DC heroes are perfect. And that's no fun to watch.. We find ourselves wanting them to lose more than we want them to win.

However, Marvel superheroes are so much more three-dimensional. They just have so much more character development backing them up. It's fun to watch them fight; it's sad to watch them lose, both in their superhero lives and in their nonsuperhero lives. Frankly, Marvel heroes tell us what we would do if we had powers and what struggles we face. DC heroes tell us what would happen if the gods came down from Mt. Olympus to fight crime.
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colddigger
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Hey, aquaman is the best!

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Russwallac
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I've never understood why people hate Aquaman- he rules 75% OF THE PLANET! Not to mention that his powers are actually pretty cool.
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Carlos
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I think it's because our race is naturally inclined to hate water. This is why underwater stories are often boring (see Tv Tropes' "Atlantis Is Boring") and why waterbenders in ATLA and TLOK rarely actually swim.
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Kamidio
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Canis Lupis
Jun 1 2012, 10:30 AM
See, Fakey, I've got the opposite problem. It really gets my knickers in a knot when someone says they prefer DC to Marvel. Marvel has the best superheroes and is a more realistic interpretation of what would happen if people got superpowers.

Don't get me wrong. There are some Marvel heroes that absolutely suck (Ghost Rider, namely. Why do you exist??!!) but there are also quite a few DC superheroes that suck (namely Superman, Wonder Woman, and Aquaman).

I hate DC. I love Marvel. But I love Batman more than Marvel. Frankly, I think Batman and his villains are the best of all comics universes. He's the most realistic hero, his comics are sufficiently dark, and his villains are just fun to watch do bad (when I watch "The Dark Knight," I tend to skip through the Batman parts and just watch the Joker. Heath Ledger did a stellar job with him). Plus, Batman's villains actually present a challenge to him (for example, Bane (the main villain in "The Dark Knight Rises," in case you don't know) actually broke Batman's back in the "Knightfall" storyline).

However, none of the DC superheroes live up to Batman's example. Green Arrow almost does. But none of the rest do. Almost all the superheroes are way too powerful with way too specific weaknesses. Superman is the prime example. He has all the superpowers any kid could want all because he gets high off our yellow sun. It's ridiculous. Plus, he is only weakened by kryptonite. None of his villains, thus, present a challenge. Brainiac, Lex Luthor, Darkseid, and (worst of all) the Toymaker. Who the hell thought Superman and his villains were a good idea?

By contrast, Marvel heroes are sooo much better. The heroes don't just fight their villains (which, in some cases, are good (I can't stand Apocalypse from the "X-men" comics)); they also fight their own personal demons. Iron Man/Tony Stark has to spend as much time fighting his alcoholism as he does fighting Mandarin. The Hulk/Bruce Banner (my favorite Marvel hero) focuses as much on defeating his own self as he does fighting Abomination and the Leader. The X-men have to focus on fighting the anti-mutant sentiment almost as much as they have to fight Magneto (my favorite Marvel villain) and his cronies.

In short, DC heroes are perfect. And that's no fun to watch.. We find ourselves wanting them to lose more than we want them to win.

However, Marvel superheroes are so much more three-dimensional. They just have so much more character development backing them up. It's fun to watch them fight; it's sad to watch them lose, both in their superhero lives and in their nonsuperhero lives. Frankly, Marvel heroes tell us what we would do if we had powers and what struggles we face. DC heroes tell us what would happen if the gods came down from Mt. Olympus to fight crime.
Mark Hamill is best Joker. Your arguement for Heath Ledger can be invalidated by a simple fact.

Mark Hamill is a live, Heath is not. Obviously, the comic book gods were irate with Heath, for his voice straying to far from the laughing maniac, and thus, they struck him down for his insolence.


Superman has only one power. The ability to manipulate kinetic energy. Flying? That's just him throwing himself. Stopping that plane without anything to anchor him? That's him reducing the plane's kinetic energy. Heat vision? That's him exciting the particles in front of him. Ice breath? He's just removing kinetic energy. I can't remember the explanation for X-ray vision, but it also involved kinetic energy.

Please note that his villains do present a challenge.

Luthor is rich, and he can get away with anything, meaning he'll always be back to start trouble. He's like a celebrity bent on world domination.
Brainiac is a world destroying robot who will always find some means of preserving himself in order to take the information stored in Earth and dispose of it.
Darkseid is lord of an empire of planets turned into volcanic hellholes, and his goal is to rule the entire galaxy. He is one of the hardest to kill, and he's always going to have back up if he is incapacitated.
Toymaker is a Batman villain, last I checked. You're thinking of Mister Myxlplyx, an immortal reality warper that proves to be ever irksome as he can range from a minor nuisance to a genocidal maniac, depending on the day of the week.

This is made all the harder when you realize Superman has the morals of any highly religious Kansan. This mean's he refuses to kill, as he would sink down to the villain's level.

The hugely abundant kryptonite(Which comes in hundreds of varieties, and is about as common as quartz. I wouldn't be surprised if Kyrton was actually an alternate version of Gallifrey, and was bigger on the inside than on the outside. Would explain why Kryptonite is so common.) isn't his only weakness. He can take a vicious beating, but he's still mortal, and will die if to much damage is sustained. Not to mention that His powers depend on yellow starlight. Which means that if exposed to artificial red starlight, he'd be powerless.(Oh my god, Krypton is Neo Nod!)

He has to balance a love life with Lois Lane, a career as a reporter, saving the city(or even the world), feeding all the Kryptonian wildlife in his Fortress of Solitude(Krytonian wildlife is supposed to be the most dangerous in the universe), cleaning said fortress, playing with Krypto, taking baths, shaving(using Kryptonite-tipped blades), and the miniscule amount of time he gets for sleep. and he has to do this each and every DAY.

Say what you want about the guy, but with stress like that, I wouldn't be surprise that he's relieving stress when he beats the ever-loving hell out of a baddie.

Not to mention if this balance ever tilts in one direction, his entire world will come crashing down on him and essentially leave him depressed because he's failed himself and those that depend on him.



I'd have to look at more Wonder Woman media, but to me, it seems like her weakness is basically the same as other humans, only that she can take a heavier beating because she's the daughter of Hades. Would that make Heracles her cousin?

Which puts something for her to deal with. Life as a civilian, life as the leader of Paradise Island, and life as the/a princess of Hades/demigoddess. Surely an avid fan of Harry Potter would understand tha fragile balances of keeping your magical life hidden from mortals?


Aquaman is awesome for the above said reasons. And his main villain has ASPERGER'S SYNDROME. How cool is that?
You know you'd want to sit down and talk with the king of the oceans and ask him about all the creature we haven't discovered yet. Maybe have a nice kelp martini.

DC heros are not perfect. They just need to seem like that to the public, in order to give them hope.
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seascorpion
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Why Can't I Hold All These Mongols?

I agree completely with Canis, I mean superman is just boring to me, the guy is a boy scout. His personality and character is like Steve buscemi's face compared to characters like V or Apollo(who was also invincible, and DC, but still an amazing character). I mean seriously, look at some of the comic books around today, why would you bother with Superman and Wonderwoman when you can read the Authority (kind of like a hardcore pseudo-fascist justice league, pretty fucking epic). I mean with things like Watchmen, V for Vendetta and the Sandman, which weren't just great comics but great literature. Why can't we hold comics to a higher standard?
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Kamidio
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Obviously you are blind, otherwise you would have read my post.




You people are just proving my point. Why improve yourself when you can see everything about your hero's personal life?

Heroes are meant to be an inspiration. They can't do that if you get to see every waking minute of their life. You shouldn't relate to your heroes, except on what they teach you.

Which is to be a productive member of society instead of being someone who is fine the way they are.

If Stephen Hawking had thought like that, there would be no 'black holes' that we oh so love to use in fiction.
Edited by Kamidio, Jun 1 2012, 06:33 PM.
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lamna
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Heroes are meant to entertain. There are many people with many tastes, hence many different kinds of fiction.

Why does liking grounded heroes prevent you from bettering yourself? Not everyone needs a role model, and not everyone draws them from superheroes.

One can enjoy Spiderman and still look up to Alexander the Great, Julius Caesar, Charlemagne, William the Conqueror, Warwick the Kingmaker, Saladin, Gustavus Adolphus, Frederick the Great, Napoleon Bonaparte or whoever pacifists look up to.

You don't need fictional heroes. There right there
Edited by lamna, Jun 1 2012, 07:09 PM.
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Carlos
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Most people are not looking for role models. Most of the comic book crowd is composed by nerds, which are into relatable characters. That is why crap like Youngblood is widely acknowledged as crap; in a comic book, action can be awesome, but it can never be the focus, lest the work become boring and stale.

Thus, the crowd looking for explosions and action alone instead of character development will not be satisfied, not because there isn't plenty of action, but because said action looks very boring on panels if you focus on it alone.
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colddigger
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Now cover art, that's something else entirely.
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Kamidio
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I never said anything about action.

Those nerds think they have a right to their opinions. Well it is my opinion that they have no right to their opinions.

Also. Action? Stale?

Let me direct you to Gurren Lagann: the satire, Johnny Boy.
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...I want a gay batman.
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Carlos
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Honestly, Batman is written as essencially a manchild. That he has a thing with Catwoman while still dressing as a bat and behaving like an immature kid is very, very creepy and fucked up.
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You're one to judge.
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