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Would you see this movie?
Topic Started: Feb 22 2011, 02:29 AM (5,472 Views)
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FallingWhale
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I know what a destroyer is, that's why I said it. Wikipedia has it right.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Destroyer

Anti-satellite missiles take a very long time to target and can only hit predictable orbits.
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T.Neo
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Fok... bru... where the hell do you guys get these kak ideas from?

I mean... you people, you know... sometimes...

We just... you know... we don't have... pornographic... relations with fokken... creatures!

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I know you'd probably call it a cliché, but have you ever heard of a little thing called 'Write what you know'. Lot easier to set it in a place you know about than a place you don't. Sure, you could research, but that won't give you the same insight into the people and area that living there for ages will.


That is true, but also... not an entire justification for the cliche insistent setting of stories in particular places. If you want to know about a particular place well, just hire someone who has lived there for a considerable amount of time, get them to show you around and explain everything, and then pay then a few hundred dollars. Easy.

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Exactly my point. Now stop whining about the lack of South African based movies and go swim with sharks, or whatever the hell South Africans do.


I'm not whining about the lack of South African based movies, I'm whining about the lack of movies set outside the USA, or at the very least, set outside LA and New York.

And... seriously bru, fokken sharks? Why would we want to swim with fokken sharks? That is a tourist thing, you know, uh, um, the tourists, you know, they like to swim... but us... no, you know, when you are down in Cape Town, you know, try to stick to the beach and, the sand and the surf, you know... cause, I mean, you know, they are sharks, they... they fokken eat people....

Swim with sharks. Ag man, what are you going to say next, that we take pleasure trips to fokken space stations?
Edited by T.Neo, Mar 2 2011, 05:53 PM.
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Kamidio
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Next I was going to say you live on the continent with the biggest amount of idiots holding the title "World Leader" in a bunch of nations that probably have like maybe two people per hundred square kilometers. Also, you surf on the backs of lions.

So stop whining that Stan Lee set Marvel Comics mostly in New York, despite the fact that he was born to immigrants and made the best superheros this side of the Prime Meridian.
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T.Neo
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:rolleyes:

I'm not whining about Stan Lee. I think his superhero stories are very good, actually... they make the cliche, they are not made up of the cliche.
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Kamidio
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Actually, both Marvel and D.C. made the cliches. Therefore, they will be original forever and ever.
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Yorick
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Plenty of movies are produced in one country and set in another.

Also, of course nobody claims it outright, but after almost every single science fiction film ever is set there, it really starts to become implied.


And most aren't.

Nobody claims such a thing a thing outright because its untrue and ridiculous.

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Rubbish. If they didn't care what the setting was they wouldn't care about the setting at all.


...Why? They obviously care that the filmmakers are transporting them someplace new but don't care where that place is. Why would they?

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That is not what is being questioned. What is being questioned is whether they have been lobotomised or not.


They're not stupid just because they don't care about the plausibility of alien-human sexual attraction.

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Are you trying to imply that anyone who dislikes anything that has anything to do with the US, is jealous and paranoid?


No. Not at all. Only if you're mad because American filmamkers and finaciers like to set their films in their hime lands.

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There are plenty of people in the US who take patriotism way too far, further than is healthy. That is no conspiracy.


It's not creepy patriotism. It's just people setting their films where they're from.

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The question is not "why care about sophont bauplans", but rather "why not care about sophont bauplans"? If you don't care about making something original here, why care about making anything?


Why not? IT'S NOT IMPORTANT. I certainly care about telling a good story and that would not have anything to do with me not caring about the alien creature design.

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How is it trivial? It is a little thing, but a film itself is a collection of little things.


Now you're just strecthing.

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Wrong. It just means that they are employing something that is cliche, and the presence of humanesque aliens in Star Trek only makes their cliche even more cliche.


Then it's cliche but ultimately trivial and no one will care or they shrug it off soon after.

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1. Not all biologists are working on cures for diseases. They do, y'know... biology.

2. Explain the scathing blog posts I've read regarding bad biology posted by various different biologists.


1. It's pretty obvious I wasn't being literal

2. A couple of nerds few and far between that already gave in their money

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What was the thought provoking idea in Minority Report? Psychic detectives? Eye scanners everywhere?

The characters in Inception were not developed? The whole plot of the film revolved around character development, which is entirely understandable because dreams are driven by psychology. We just don't get to see a lot of the other characters' development because the plot is not focused on them.

You have to look at dream logic to understand the film... it isn't a politics film, it isn't a technology film, it isn't a sociology film... it's a psycholgy film. Or at least, it's trying to be.

It's also pretty funny that you criticse Inception for not being original when it has at least twenty times the originality compared to this concept. Maybe not in the story itself, but the actual film has a lot of original concepts in it that I personally have never seen before.


It's about what is justice in a world where you can prevent crime.

Your defense of Inception makes no sense. I don't think you know what you're talking about.

Yes. "Inception" has original concepts but they never came together very well.

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Let me rephrase: The core concept is badly written.


That can't be badly or well written at all.

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That is exceptional circumstance, no filmmaker can rely on that to make a good film.

Also, since Casablanca etc exists, it actually makes your story more cliche. It creates cliches, it does not justify them.


What? No filmmaker can rely on a good cast and crew to make a good film?

My story is more cliche because ofa completely unrelated story?

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Yes, but, you also just ignored my entire comment there.


No. I did not.

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My point is that a philosophy lesson can be very entertaining indeed.


Of course it CAN be but entertainment is the author's #1 priority.

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The rest of the film, however... well, why don't we start with inhabiting and controlling the body of an alien who's species has the ability to not only connect mentally to eachother and the wildlife around them, but also to what is basically a biological version of the internet, and also an incredibly detailed backstory involving the natural world of the setting and the human technological element.

On top of that, brilliant graphic design work coupled to absolutely brilliant graphics themselves, of which the like has never been seen previously. Of course, because it is made by James Cameron, who is crazy about this stuff. In a good way.


You can say that there were some ideas in the story that you liked but you still found it to terribly produced. You don't owe anyone to say otherwise.

I personally hated the fake-looking graphics. It's a very disappointing film.

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Sorry, can't I be reminded of a similar sounding title? Maybe the lack of imagination is on your part?

Or maybe... and I know this is a bit of a long-shot here, but... maybe, what about the fact that "My Name is Earl" and "My Name is Eli" sound similar? Maybe, because this is due to the English language, and has nothing to do with the perceptions of either one of us?
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It's no one's fault that you're reminded of another title but to shrug off a similar title as unoriginal and let it distract you from enjoying the content is your fault alone.

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You know, 'falls for a native' is actually incredibly similar to the story of Jake Sully and the guy in Pocahontas that he's based off of. It's just that here the protagonist is fighting against a common enemy to him, the natives and his own people, rather than a big bad that wants to crush the natives alone so that the guys back home can profit.


I know they both fall for natives but the romance isn't a central storyline in "Eli" unlike "Pocahontas" and "Avatar." "Eli's" central storyline is learning to become a leader, be courageous, assimilate to human culture and care about others above himself.

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If you agree with that, would you be fine with me calling this an "I Am Number Four" ripoff?


Of course not. I haven't even seen that movie and barely read the source novel. I'm just saying it makes far more sense to call it a 'Pocahontas'
rip-off.

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That is true, but also... not an entire justification for the cliche insistent setting of stories in particular places. If you want to know about a particular place well, just hire someone who has lived there for a considerable amount of time, get them to show you around and explain everything, and then pay then a few hundred dollars. Easy.


What if you can't afford any of that and the location doesn't even matter?
Edited by Yorick, Mar 3 2011, 12:11 AM.
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Kamidio
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Yorick please, stop. None of us like this movie. If you can't take the criticism, then leave.
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urufumarukai
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Well that was harsh, I rather enjoy the concept.
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colddigger
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I for one enjoy the large amounts of quotes in this thread, I just wish Yorick wouldn't suddenly start typing inside of one as he forgets a "]".
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Kamidio
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Well I for one want to stop this bickering and it's become obvious that a lot of people here don't like the concept. T. Neo, for one.
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Yorick
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Yorick please, stop. None of us like this movie. If you can't take the criticism, then leave.


He's barely even criticizing the movie! I'm upset about his insane ramblings against the U.S. and plausibility of alien-human romances.

Why don't you like the idea?
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FallingWhale
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Yorick
Mar 3 2011, 12:12 AM
Why don't you like the idea?
It is so massively cliched that it would be painful to watch.
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colddigger
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;D Here's a thought, make the chick have the hots for him since he's disguised as a human, but have him just think they are friends and that human friendship is just far more touchy feely than his own species. Nice awkward moment near the end and everyone is happy.

As for the USA, I suggest setting it in China but have all the scenes obviously American, any accents that you put in the script for a character to be American, and all references and so on to be American.
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T.Neo
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And most aren't.


But it is still a disproportionate number, at least in science fiction terms.

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Nobody claims such a thing a thing outright because its untrue and ridiculous.


Oh really? And who are you to say that? As a person from the US yourself, you can only have a second hand feeling of what the rest of the world thinks of your community as a whole.

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...Why? They obviously care that the filmmakers are transporting them someplace new but don't care where that place is. Why would they?


So the audience won't care if I, to save FX costs, decide to set my Mars mission in the Arizona desert?

I am still transporting them somewhere pretty exotic, I mean... they don't care, right?

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They're not stupid just because they don't care about the plausibility of alien-human sexual attraction.


And what says they don't care?

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No. Not at all. Only if you're mad because American filmamkers and finaciers like to set their films in their hime lands.


There is a difference between "like to" and "insist on doing it every single time".

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It's not creepy patriotism. It's just people setting their films where they're from.


Actually I wasn't referring to films being set in places, I was referring to the actual creepy patriotism itself, and how it is, or at least might be, inspired by the insistant USA-ism in films.

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Why not? IT'S NOT IMPORTANT. I certainly care about telling a good story and that would not have anything to do with me not caring about the alien creature design.


You care about telling a good story? I have not yet seen proof of that, I'm afraid...

So you just want to perpetuate a continued cliche implausibility that is inherent to many films, that makes 95% of people believe that an alien sophont would look exactly like a human?

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Now you're just strecthing.


No... no I am not. Films are all about the little things, if you've ever looked into how films are made and put together you'll notice that people pay a huge amount of attention to the little things.

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Then it's cliche but ultimately trivial and no one will care or they shrug it off soon after.


It fosters a rubbish understanding in the population at large.

Kind of like showing cavemen and dinosaurs together on film.

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1. It's pretty obvious I wasn't being literal

2. A couple of nerds few and far between that already gave in their money


1. Your comment makes even less sense, then.

2. Nerds that are way smarter than you and I combined, and who have potentially achieved quite a lot in their particular field.

They spent their money, but they could convince a good deal of other people not to.

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It's about what is justice in a world where you can prevent crime.


Oh wow. Nice concept, but can the movie pull it off?

To be honest, I didn't really get into the movie, but I wouldn't go as far as to bash it because of that.

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Your defense of Inception makes no sense. I don't think you know what you're talking about.

Yes. "Inception" has original concepts but they never came together very well.


You are entitled to your opinion, nobody is stopping you from expressing that.

I don't know what I'm talking about? What? :ermm:

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That can't be badly or well written at all.


It can. Everything can either be good, or bad, if it is supposed to do something or someone cares about it.

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What? No filmmaker can rely on a good cast and crew to make a good film?

My story is more cliche because ofa completely unrelated story?


You're not fully getting what I'm trying to say: You always need to aim for a good cast and crew that can make a good film. But you can't have a crappy film and then somehow expect a good cast and crew to make it work.

Of course it is cliche because of a completely unrelated story, if the 'unrelated' story shares some elements, even if they're minor. But mostly if they've been used over and over and over and over again in film.

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Of course it CAN be but entertainment is the author's #1 priority.


Yes... yes you did ignore what I said. Two times in a row.

"mindless rubbish that is entertaining" and "entertaining philosophical concept" are two different things, and two different things that can be the basis for a story.

If you had to ask me personally, and probably a good deal of other people, the latter is superior.

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You can say that there were some ideas in the story that you liked but you still found it to terribly produced. You don't owe anyone to say otherwise.

I personally hated the fake-looking graphics. It's a very disappointing film.


When did I find it terribly produced? I didn't mind it, I just hated the blue catpeople and the story that I could predict 30 minutes ahead of time.

I really don't know which of the graphics was fake-looking... granted the graphics are not 100% photoreal, but they come damn close and they're very well done. I think the way they were used was unrealistic sometimes... some sequences are just too over the top, visually.

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It's no one's fault that you're reminded of another title but to shrug off a similar title as unoriginal and let it distract you from enjoying the content is your fault alone.


Me enjoy the content of 'Eli'? Not a chance, sorry... :(

I said it was unoriginal, I never said it was unoriginal because of My Name is Earl. :rolleyes:

I just said that it reminded me of My Name is Earl.

I know they both fall for natives but the romance isn't a central storyline in "Eli" unlike "Pocahontas" and "Avatar." "Eli's" central storyline is learning to become a leader, be courageous, assimilate to human culture and care about others above himself.

In Avatar the protagonist learns to assimilate to the culture of the natives, and he cares a lot for the people he ends up leading. The stories are very different but they do contain vaguely similar elements.

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Of course not. I haven't even seen that movie and barely read the source novel. I'm just saying it makes far more sense to call it a 'Pocahontas'
rip-off.


Ok then... it's an I Am Number Four ripoff. :P

:rolleyes:

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What if you can't afford any of that and the location doesn't even matter?


Because the location does matter. Again, blank 3D space...

A movie budget can't afford a few hundred dollars? Even 40 dollars? Even films with comparatively low budgets have budgets in the millions or hundreds of thousands of dollars at the very least.

Do you want to produce and direct Eli in your back yard? :rolleyes:

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I just wish Yorick wouldn't suddenly start typing inside of one as he forgets a "]".


That does get quite confusing...

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He's barely even criticizing the movie! I'm upset about his insane ramblings against the U.S. and plausibility of alien-human romances.


I'm upset by your insistence that your unoriginal, cliche, unworthwhile, unscintillating, undeveloped story concept is potentially the worst thing I've ever seen. It's either that, or your insistence that it's actually worthwhile.

Yes. I am not a very nice person when you say I am insane, or anything to that effect. :|

Civil arguments are far better than un-civil ones.

I am not being 'anti-US'. Not at all. I am just being pro-World. The US only covers a small percentage of Earth's land area. But when you say I am being "against the US", that really does reinforce my annoyance with creepy patriotism.

And when it comes to alien-human romances, you know what the-
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:rolleyes:

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As for the USA, I suggest setting it in China but have all the scenes obviously American, any accents that you put in the script for a character to be American, and all references and so on to be American.


I can't really decide which would be worse, but it'd probably certainly be US-ising a foreign location...
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