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| More aquatic than I thought... | |
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| Topic Started: Dec 3 2010, 12:25 PM (1,381 Views) | |
| Carlos | Dec 3 2010, 12:25 PM Post #1 |
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Adveho in me Lucifero
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It seems that, according to oxygen isotope studies, spinosaurs not just were piscivores, but also appearently semi-aquatic, with Spinosaurs being the least aquatic species and Siamosaurus the most. You all know what to do now... |
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| dialforthedevil | Dec 3 2010, 02:10 PM Post #2 |
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Frumentarii Administrator
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Where was this information from? Sorry if im being a bit of a bastard when it comes to these things...i just wanna see whether its a legitimate source
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| Scrublord | Dec 3 2010, 03:15 PM Post #3 |
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Father Pellegrini
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What adaptations would they have had for life in the water? Webbed feet? Flattened, paddle-like tails? Anyway, I can imagine that if they'd been allowed to evolve for longer they might have become even more aquatic. They could have evolved into dinosaurian pinnipeds. |
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| Carlos | Dec 3 2010, 04:25 PM Post #4 |
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Adveho in me Lucifero
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This is according to isotope studies, in which spinosaurid results were closer to turtles and crocodiles than to other theropods (Spinosaurus aside) |
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| Rick Raptor | Dec 3 2010, 06:10 PM Post #5 |
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Adolescent
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I knew about this, too, but I read the thing with Siamosaurus being more aquatic than Spinosaurus only on Wikipedia, so I wasn´t sure about it. There is also this nice depiction of a speculative fully aquatic Spinosaurid: http://dinohunter2.deviantart.com/gallery/?offset=24#/d2xkoos Edited by Rick Raptor, Dec 3 2010, 06:16 PM.
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| Carlos | Dec 3 2010, 06:24 PM Post #6 |
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Adveho in me Lucifero
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http://johnfaa.deviantart.com/art/Spinosauria-188366267 I just uploaded my own ideas before I saw that picture. Now I feel like I ripped off someone's idea, when I didn't. |
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| Kamidio | Dec 3 2010, 06:37 PM Post #7 |
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The Game Master of the SSU:NC
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Great minds think alike. Take Darwin and Wallace for example. |
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| T.Neo | Dec 3 2010, 06:47 PM Post #8 |
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Translunar injection: TLI
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This is interesting stuff, though I think an aquatic (or semi-aquatic) Spinosaurid would; - Rely on it's tail more than it's legs for propulsion. - Possibly experience limb atrophication. - Inhabit a niche more like that of a sea lion or seal than a cetacean. - Potentially posess a full-length extension of the back from the presence of neural spines, rather than a defined "fin". I'm not entirely sure about any of them though. How could spinosaurids rely on their legs for propulsion through the water? If their legs atrophied, how would that impact their life on land? Could they become near-fully aquatic and what competition would they face? |
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| Kamidio | Dec 3 2010, 07:04 PM Post #9 |
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The Game Master of the SSU:NC
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They would face the pliosaurs and sea crocs. |
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| Carlos | Dec 3 2010, 07:12 PM Post #10 |
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Adveho in me Lucifero
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1- I am actually somewhat uncertain if they could use the tail for propulsion, seeing as theropods had tendons making the tail more stiff. Granted, it was still relatively felxible, as any dromeosaur expert can tell you, but still I wonder if it would conflict wih the capacity of the animal to use the tail to propel itself. 2- I doubt spinosaurs would experience limb atrophiacation AT ALL. Metriorhynchid crocodillians, for instance, didn't reduced the limbs at all, in fact their hindlimbs were longer than their front limbs, a condition that is usually reversed in marine tetrapods. Indeed, limb atrophication seems to be restricted to marine mammals, as their "up and down" undulatory movement conflicts with the presence of hindlimbs, while the presence of hindlimbs is an hydrodynamic advantage to aquatic reptiles and animals that swim like them, such as sharks and ray finned fish. Why I don't know, but I see no reason for spinosaurs to reduced their limbs in any way. 3- I agree with that, though the "cetacean" and "pinnipede" niches are not as easy to distinguish as one would think; seals do compete with dolphins, even if they can move on land if they want too. In any case, my marine spinosaurs are usually either macropredators, specialised in taking large fish and occasionally marine tetrapods, or river dolphin analogues (yeah, I destroyed my xenometacetes for them). 4- As I said, the "fins" are essencially just shorter and sharper versions of their dorsal humps. |
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| Kamidio | Dec 3 2010, 07:31 PM Post #11 |
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The Game Master of the SSU:NC
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In other word badass sea reptiles. |
SSU:NC - Finding a new home. Quotes WAA
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| T.Neo | Dec 3 2010, 07:35 PM Post #12 |
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Translunar injection: TLI
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That makes sense, but how would they use their rear legs to swim? Dinosaur legs are erect, not sprawling, and theropod legs can be quite long...
Is there really an incentive for a "shortening and sharpening" of the dorsal hump? I suppose when you look at incthyosaurs... they developed a dorsal fin without any bone there at all. |
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| Kamidio | Dec 3 2010, 07:41 PM Post #13 |
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The Game Master of the SSU:NC
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The spinosaurs have bones to work with. Why have something and not use it? |
SSU:NC - Finding a new home. Quotes WAA
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| Carlos | Dec 3 2010, 07:43 PM Post #14 |
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Adveho in me Lucifero
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Mostly because the leg is, to put it simply, "the center of power in a dinosaur's body". Due to how well developed they are, and how even non-avian theropods most likely used their legs to swim, I doubt they'd loose their role in propulsion so soon. Eventually I could see the tail taking over that role, but what if I am right about theropod tail anatomy and it can't be used effectively as a propulsion organ? As for the fins, hydrodynamic reasons. I don't expect something with a Spinosaurus style dorsal hump to be decently hydrodynamic. |
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| Kamidio | Dec 3 2010, 08:00 PM Post #15 |
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The Game Master of the SSU:NC
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I go with the sail theory myself. |
SSU:NC - Finding a new home. Quotes WAA
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