Welcome Guest [Log In] [Register]
Speculative biology is simultaneously a science and form of art in which one speculates on the possibilities of life and evolution. What could the world look like if dinosaurs had never gone extinct? What could alien lifeforms look like? What kinds of plants and animals might exist in the far future? These questions and more are tackled by speculative biologists, and the Speculative Evolution welcomes all relevant ideas, inquiries, and world-building projects alike. With a member base comprising users from across the world, our community is the largest and longest-running place of gathering for speculative biologists on the web.

While unregistered users are able to browse the forum on a basic level, registering an account provides additional forum access not visible to guests as well as the ability to join in discussions and contribute yourself! Registration is free and instantaneous.

Join our community today!

Username:   Password:
Add Reply
Alterniverse; A world where dinosaurs, mammals, notosuchids, pterosaurs are dominant
Topic Started: Aug 5 2010, 05:55 AM (4,693 Views)
Cephylus
Member Avatar
Torando of Terror
 *  *  *  *  *  *  *
Okay here is a project I've been working on for some time. It has a very common theme, what if the asteroid never crashed at the end of Cretaceous and if dinosaurs had survived as the dominant clade on Earth. I already have a website on wikidot but I haven't yet discussed it much on this forum. I've been working on it alone except for some help from by paleontology crazed friends but now I'm posting it here for some suggestions and corrections since I want to make this project as plausible as possible and my ideas are limited.

So here are the general settings for this project:
- First, most importantly, the asteroid missed and so dinosaurs went on as the dominant clade. Although many dinosaurs were killed off during many extinction events in the Cenezoic, they still are the dominant land vertebrates in the present.
- As you can guess, mammals don't fare well as they do in HE but they are still one of the secondary major clades and a successful group. They fare far better than their Mesozoic ancestors with dinosaurs. However, mammals are still the prey and dinosaurs are still the predators..... with some exceptions
- Pterosaurs are one of the other successful clades. They fill various flyer niches occupied by birds in HE. There are some flightless animals that fill large omnivore/carnivore niches.
- Mosasaurs aren't so lucky in this New World. They survive and thrive in some places, but they are not the dominant sea vertebrates and their diversity reduced as they are more and more pushed off the stage by marine mammals and penguin-like sea dinos.
- Champsosaurs are still around and some managed to quite successfuly establish themselves in semi aquatic/ marine niches.
- Notosuchids are another successful clade and they range from small insectivores to gigantic dinosaur guzzling sabre toothed apex predators. All of them are heterodont and they distinctly resemble mammals.

So what do you think of this world? I'll be posting more specific stuff when this draws some attention..... Also I need help with those Latin names for classfication..... ;)
Spoiler: click to toggle
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Replies:
Cephylus
Member Avatar
Torando of Terror
 *  *  *  *  *  *  *
Got a few ideas:
Knuckle-walking giant sloth-like therizinosaurs
Flat-snouted herbivorous notosuchians (like hardrosaurs)
Terrestrial hypercarnivorous notosuchid that looks like the usual crocodilian, but with longer legs and shorter snout
Hippo-like notosuchians which look like aeteosars but with more crocodilian armor
Strong jawed omnivorous notosuchians with pangolin-like armor
Massive bipedal therizinosaurs
Marginocephalians with strange hollow crests like lambeosaurines
Spoiler: click to toggle
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Cephylus
Member Avatar
Torando of Terror
 *  *  *  *  *  *  *
The Dodo
Sep 13 2010, 01:44 AM
Great concepts :D , you've obviously spent a lot of time on this. Love the Killiquin.
Thank you both for watching this project :D
Spoiler: click to toggle
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
The Dodo
Member Avatar
Prime Specimen
 *  *  *  *  *  *  *
I like most of the ideas, a little unsure on the knuckle walking therizinosaur though.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
dialforthedevil
Member Avatar
Frumentarii Administrator

No i think thats pretty cool knuckle walking therizinosaurs :)
Yeah i really do like this project although unfortunately i dont have the expertise on dinosaurs like you guys do...
Please come visit A Scientfic Fantasy http://s1.zetaboards.com/Conceptual_Evolution/topic/3433014/1/

ALSO!!! JOIN THE NEW RPG SITE!!! FOR ALL MEMBERS!!! IM GOING TO RUN MA GLOBAL SIMULATORS THERE!!! http://s4.zetaboards.com/jasonguppy/index/

Join the Campaign to save minotaurs from extinction!!! (include this in your signature to show your support!)
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Cephylus
Member Avatar
Torando of Terror
 *  *  *  *  *  *  *
dialforthedevil
Sep 19 2010, 06:10 AM
No i think thats pretty cool knuckle walking therizinosaurs :)
Yeah i really do like this project although unfortunately i dont have the expertise on dinosaurs like you guys do...
Thanks, but i also don't have real expertise.... I just like dinosaurs really much
Spoiler: click to toggle
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Cephylus
Member Avatar
Torando of Terror
 *  *  *  *  *  *  *
PACHYCEPHALOSAURS: BLEEDBEAKS AND KILLIQUINS

Pachycephalosaurs, being omnivorous and fairly adaptable to changes in their environments, enjoys a wide and rather successful distribution across Europe, Asia and North America. North America, especially, is a heaven for pachycephalosaurs, for North American pachys fill various niches from pint-sized nocturnal insectivores to enormous, appalling and carnivorous quadrupeds vaguely resembling large ceratopsians.
Pachycephalosaurs survived the K-T boundary and during the Paleocene and Eocene periods they retained fairly conservative forms, bipedal browsing herbivores with domed heads. Fossil records indicate that early Cenezoic pachycephalosaurs were quite widespread omnivores across the Laurasian continents. Later, after the Eocene/ Oligocene extinction events occured, pachycephalosaurs enjoyed an explosion into a wide variety of forms, from massive quadrupedal megaherbivores to bipedal, fast-footed predators and strange qilled insectivores with flexible, sticky tongues. However, the Ice Ages reduced the diversity of pachycephalosaurs considerably and caused various forms to disappear. Today, only two groups of pachycephalosaurs survive to this day, the Bleedbeaks and the Killiquins.

KILLIQUINS
Killiquins are rather generalistic pachycephalosaurs with the more conservative body plan, small to middle sized omnivorous bipeds with domed heads and relatively slender build.
Killiquins are mostly small omnivores willing to feed on almost anything edible that they are able to find, from browsing plant material to carcasses of large animals left over from bigger predators and slow moving reptiles or amphibians.
All Killiquins possess long, grasping fingers with opposable first digits for picking up food items, with the first digits bearing razor-sharp claws for defending themselves against predators and territorial combats in mating season. Their main, and the most effective defense is the erectile, barbed qill-like feathers loosely attatched to the skin, sticking up sideways from their tails and which they use to whack predators.

Dappled Killiquin
Size: 1~1.1 meters, approximately 5~7 killograms, although variations can be extreme
Diet: omnivorous; mostly a highly selective browser, eats soft, nutritious young leaves, herbs, flowers, any kind of available fruit, also commonly found feeding on small invertebrates such as worms and insects, occasionally pecks at flesh on carrion and adults sometimes hunt for small lizards and frogs
Habitat: temperate or subtropical forests
Small omnivores of North America and Europe, Killiquins are tiny pachycephalosaurs, among the smaller ornithischians in this world.
Killiquins have a fairly conservative pachycephalosaur form, except that they have a leaner, lighter and more delicate-looking build compared to most pachycephalosaurs, with longer necks and sharp foreclaws. A notable feature of these small pachycephalosaurs is that that they have 'hands' with long, grasping fingers and opposable first digits, thumbs, for picking up food items. The first digit also bears razor sharp claws which are used as weapons for defense against predators or as a weapon in territorial fights between males in mating season. Killiquins generally have large, pale eyes, sharp faces and relatively small, narrow beaks.
Dappled Killiquins are beautifully colored animals, as they are colored in a shade of light violet and pink, dappled with splashes of darker purple, with a blueish tinge on their backs. Their forequarters are covered in a bushy mane of light greyish fur-like feathers, running down the neck and forming a kind of 'cape' between the shoulders and the neck. Males have larger, darker and overall more impressive manes compared to females; one of the various methods the Dappled Killiquin males uses to attract females. Another unique feature of the Dappled Killiquins is that these small animals have long, erectile barbed qill-like feathers, which are loosely attatched to the skin, protruding out from their tales sideways. A threatened Killiquin will shift its position to a quadruped stance, points its tail upward, and whacks any enemy hard with its qilled tail.
In mating season, Dappled Killiquins excrete horomones to draw each other, as they usually rarely gather in large numbers, and males also make high-pitched squealing noises to draw females, and up to 3 males at once will engage in a small battle of clawing each other with their thumb claws. The final winner naturally claims the female. Dappled Killiquin males are generally larger, more aggressive and brightly colored compared to females, and once two individuals are mated, they form an almost lifelong monogamous pair, the two working in a team to gather food and defend their nest. Females reproduce up to 15 eggs at once, which are directly incubated by mostly the females, while the male mostly gathers food for himself and his mate, but positions are occasionally shifted.

Prairie Killiquin
Size: 2.3~3 meters, 70~90 killograms
Diet: mostly herbivorous; a browser that will feed on herbs, soft shoots, leaves from small shrubs and any kind of available fruit, occasionally invertebrates such as insects, flesh from carrion of large and middle sized animals, excretements from large grazing herbivores, juveniles are more omnivorous and will mostly feed on invertebrates and sometimes slow-moving mammals and reptiles
Habitat: temperate grasslands, especially North American prairies, more specifically the mesic regions
Distribution: very widely spread across the Great Plains of U.S and Canada, found across North and South Dakota, Nebraska, Kansas, Oklahoma, Texas, Montana, Wyoming, Colorado, Wisconsin, Illinois, Iowa and Canadian lands such as Alberta and Manitoba
Prairie Killiquins are another species of the Killiquins, small North American and European pachycephalosaurs. They are specifically prairie-dwelling animals, as their name indicates, and is found across a relatively wide range across North America, mainly in the Great Plains.
They look fairly similar to most Killiquins in general body shape, although they are far more larger and stouter, overall less delicate-looking and relatively robust. They have more pronounced domed heads, which are used by males for butting each other in mating season, with long, curved horn-like protrusions colored in a threatening shade of bright violte sprouting from their foreheads, which can easily gore the side of some small carnivore. However, they lack the sharp thumb claws most Killiquins possess. Prairie Killiquins also have broader faces than most smaller Killiquin species, with more pronounced jawbone and cheek protrusions, giving their faces a boxier look. They also have large, pale eyes protected by brow ridges, with small beaks in proportion to their body size. Prairie Killiquins also possess the erectile barbed tail qills which Killiquins are famous for. Prairie Killiquin tail qills are colored in metallic violet which matches their forehead horns; both weapons are used to defend themselves against solitary predatory dromaeosaurs or pack-hunting small tyrannosaurs such as Volfs, and even though these Killiquins occasionally falls prey to the latter attacking in large numbers, Prairie Killiquins fear almost nothing on the Prairie. For this reason, small, docile ceratopsians are often found grazing alongside Prairie Killiquins.
Prairie Killiquins are colored in bold, lurid shades. Their backs are covered in downy, metallic silvery blue fur-like feathers mottled with metallic gold spots. Streaks of vertical dark violet stripes run down their sides, with their bellies colored in a shade of dark, golden yellow.
These pachycephalosaurs are highly omnivorous, with a relatively wide and flexible range of diet (juveniles are less herbivorous compared to adults). They are initially browsing herivores; they will feed on almost any browsing plant matter, including twigs and bark. Given a chance, Prairie Killiquins can consume almost any organic matter found in their habitats, including slow moving skinks and guzzling on flesh from fresh Volf kills.
Male Prairie Killiquins are larger than females and are colored in a bit more vivid scheme. Males also possess relatively pronounced horns compared to females, which they use in territorial combats in mating season. The combats are not very serious; a brief battle of wrestling with beaks and butting each other lightly on the sides. Prairie Killiquins form a bond between two individuals and found in pairs, but while they are not completely polygamous, they are not completely monogamous as well; both the male and the female in a pair will occasionally share brief courtships with individuals from other pairs; a strategy to produce offsprings with superior traits. A female produces up to five offsprings a year. A pair builds a nest consisting of decaying plant matter, twigs, dried mud and dirt. The eggs are directly incubated by both male and female individuals, and hatched offsprings take about 2 to 3 years to completely mature.

Nut-Cracking Killiquin
Size: around 1.2 meters, 21~23 killograms
Diet: seeds, any kind of available fruit, nutritious, high-energy plant material, large ground-dwelling insects such as beetles and other small invertebrates such as grubs.
Habitat: temperate forests
Distribution: in any forested region across the U.S
Nut-Cracking Killiquins are small pachycephalosaurs with a beak morphology resembling that of parrots. It is a typical Killiquin, a smallish omnivorous biped. This species also possesses erectile barbed qills sprouting from their tails and used for self defense. They are rather common across North America, occuring in any forested region in what is the U.S in HE. Nut-Cracking Killiquins are mostly covered with light greyish feathers for insulation except for their undersides and legs, which are covered in pale, light violet scales.
The most defining physical characteristic of these particular species of Killiquins is their strong, curved, broad bill resembling that of parrots. The upper mandible is very broad, curves downward, and fairly sharp-tipped. It is not fused to the skull, which allows it to move independently, and results in a tremendous biting force; adequate for cracking hard nuts and seeds. The lower mandible is less broad, with a sharp, upward facing cutting edge.
They are extremely social creatures, living in a large but lose group of up to 100 individuals consisting of monogamous pairs. They usually communicate by making loud, chattering vocalizations and occasionally high-pitched squeaking noises. These pachycephalosaurs make a mound consisting of various organic and non-organic matter to contain their eggs, which both the male and female incubates directly.

Mind-Boggler
Size: 2~3 meters, weighs around 30 killograms
Diet: occasionally feeds on fruits, easily digestable and nutritious plant matter, any kind of edible invertebrate, small reptiles, mammals, amphibians and other dinosaurians smaller than themselves.
Habitat: riparian/ lacustrine environments near wetlands
Distribution: mostly found in the Carribean islands surrounding the Floridan peninsula, mostly the Bahamas
The wetlands of the Bahamas are home to a very bizarre, rather disturbing-looking pachycephalosaur, a black, hairy and gaunt nocturnal predator of smallish creatures. They are the Mind-Bogglers, and their appearance is indeed, truly mind-boggling for an ornithischian. This creature has huge, bulging pale eyes suited for nocturnal hunting and a sharp, narrow and serrated beak adequate for snatching up and killing smallish prey. Their entire bodies are covered with a coat of long, shaggy black hair-like feathers giving these creatures an unpleasent, demon-like look. They do not have the regular pachycephalosaurian body plan, lacking the peculiar domed heads except for a bump on their foreheads and the traces of horns rimming the bulge. Although they are the second largest bipedal pachycephalosaur, they are extremely light for their size because of their slender, hypergracile body build with long, elongated necks and tails. They also possess long, muscular legs tipped with razor-sharp claws for kicking the hell out of small, ground-dwelling animals. Mind-Bogglers do not show much sexual dimorphism between males and females, except for the tails of male individuals being tipped with fan-like feathers colored in a dark reddish shade.
Mind-Bogglers are nither Killiquins or Bleedbeaks, but the last species of hypercarnivorous pachycephalosaurs and a relict of the lineages of long-gone bipedal, slender and fast-footed predatory pachycephalosaurs which used to inhabit large areas of North America and Europe. This particular species was able to survive due to the isolation and the lack of therapod carnivores occupying a similar niche elsewhere in the mainland continents.
Mind-Bogglers are mostly solitary animals, although they sometimes communicate with each other with a series of ear-piercing shrieks.
Edited by Cephylus, Sep 23 2010, 07:18 AM.
Spoiler: click to toggle
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
The Dodo
Member Avatar
Prime Specimen
 *  *  *  *  *  *  *
I like the Mind-Boggler, I think it's an interesting concept for a Pachycephalosaur. Though, weren't the Dappled Killiquin and Prairie Killiquin in a previous post?
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Cephylus
Member Avatar
Torando of Terror
 *  *  *  *  *  *  *
gonna create a new topic for this project...
Edited by Cephylus, Sep 23 2010, 09:03 PM.
Spoiler: click to toggle
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
1 user reading this topic (1 Guest and 0 Anonymous)
ZetaBoards - Free Forum Hosting
Free Forums with no limits on posts or members.
« Previous Topic · Alternative Evolution · Next Topic »
Add Reply