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| Flying geckos | |
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| Topic Started: Jun 8 2010, 12:49 PM (2,098 Views) | |
| Carlos | Jun 8 2010, 12:49 PM Post #1 |
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Adveho in me Lucifero
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I've pretty much overlooked modern gliding geckos all this time, when they are probably the reptiles with the biggest chances of going aerial. I invision future flying geckos as having bat like wings, derived as the membranes along the arms and legs fused to the flaps along the torso. The digits of tthe forelimbs, all with mebranes within them already, and with the thumb already clawless, would be all wing fingers; they could still retain the pads that allow them to climb, thus having the fingers still having the function of gluing the animal to a vertical surface in other to rest, or they could just loose them all together and instead rely just on their feet to stay attached, thus somewhat looking like bats when perching, using their hindlimbs to glue themselves to rocks or trees upside down. I doubt they'd go bipedal though, considering their anatomy. |
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Lemuria: http://s1.zetaboards.com/Conceptual_Evolution/topic/5724950/ Terra Alternativa: http://s1.zetaboards.com/Conceptual_Evolution/forum/460637/ My Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/Carliro ![]() | |
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| Ammonite | Jun 9 2010, 06:21 PM Post #16 |
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Adolescent
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Just an inquiry, not a critique: Don't the bristles on a gecko's toes resemble the ciliated edges of a human finger rather than strands of fur? |
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| Toad of Spades | Jun 9 2010, 09:54 PM Post #17 |
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Clorothod
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Yes they do. Here's what they look like under the microscope. ![]() If they derive a body covering from these, it could look quite different from fur or hair. It would also be possible for them to develop the body covering and other essential requirements for powered flight first (ie. endothermy, high metabolism, advanced heart), before flight itself. If they evolve this way, it could be possible to develop something similar to a feather, using the bristle edges to hook together. Edited by Toad of Spades, Jun 9 2010, 09:58 PM.
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Sorry Link, I don't give credit. Come back when you're a little...MMMMMM...Richer. Bread is an animal and humans are %90 aluminum. | |
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| Ammonite | Jun 10 2010, 02:58 PM Post #18 |
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Adolescent
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Cool! Thanks for that Yeah, I can see them becoming an effective dermal covering now. If these geckos were able to evolve such a covering of cilia, would other parts be able to stick to flat surfaces as well? :O.o:
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| Holben | Jun 10 2010, 02:59 PM Post #19 |
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Rumbo a la Victoria
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They shouldn't, but could. |
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Time flows like a river. Which is to say, downhill. We can tell this because everything is going downhill rapidly. It would seem prudent to be somewhere else when we reach the sea. "It is the old wound my king. It has never healed." | |
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| MitchBeard | Jun 10 2010, 10:52 PM Post #20 |
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proud gondwanan
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It would make an interesting way of catching prey. |
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| Toad of Spades | Jun 10 2010, 11:18 PM Post #21 |
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Clorothod
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Lol, what if they get stuck on their back against a smooth surface?
Edited by Toad of Spades, Jun 10 2010, 11:19 PM.
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Sorry Link, I don't give credit. Come back when you're a little...MMMMMM...Richer. Bread is an animal and humans are %90 aluminum. | |
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| Ammonite | Jun 11 2010, 12:02 AM Post #22 |
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Adolescent
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That could actually be pretty dangerous to the gecko in a number of ways. Maybe they could release a sort of dermal lubrication to fix this? |
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| Margaret Pye | Jun 11 2010, 12:38 AM Post #23 |
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Adult
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Well, they have no difficulty detaching their toes from surfaces when they want to. The question is whether they'd want to be sticky all over. Hmm... living flypaper. |
| My speculative dinosaur project. With lots of fluff, parental care and mammalian-level intelligence, and the odd sophont. | |
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| Ammonite | Jun 11 2010, 12:50 AM Post #24 |
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Adolescent
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They are able to detach their feet by pushing down with one foot while pulling away with another foot. If their back got stuck to something, they wouldn't be able to free themselves unless they could either manipulate the cilia or affect them in some way like releasing the dermal lubricant I mentioned. So it isn't a question of whether they would want to or not. Not unless they could conciously affect the cilia, which is something they are currently unable to do. |
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| Margaret Pye | Jun 11 2010, 01:14 AM Post #25 |
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Adult
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No, they can consciously affect the cilia. |
| My speculative dinosaur project. With lots of fluff, parental care and mammalian-level intelligence, and the odd sophont. | |
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| Carlos | Jun 11 2010, 06:19 AM Post #26 |
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Adveho in me Lucifero
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Presumably the cilia aside from that on the toes would evolve in a way of avoiding attaching to things; the cilia in the feet on modern geckos appearently already avoids sticking to each other and to dust. Otherwise, however, some species could have attaching cilia in the feet or wing membranes, in order to help catch prey |
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Lemuria: http://s1.zetaboards.com/Conceptual_Evolution/topic/5724950/ Terra Alternativa: http://s1.zetaboards.com/Conceptual_Evolution/forum/460637/ My Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/Carliro ![]() | |
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| Ammonite | Jun 12 2010, 06:59 PM Post #27 |
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Adolescent
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Here is a section of Wikipedia's article on geckos that describes the adhesive qualities of a gecko's feet:
It seems that a gecko's foot will initially stick to a surface on contact and that the gecko has to peel the toe off the surface in order to release it. Dirt does get stuck to their toes on contact but the setae will release the dirt afterward as a self-cleaning mechanism. aside from the fact that - given the forementioned information - a gecko's toe might initially get stuck on some other part of its body until released, it is unlikely that this would happen due to their physiology. Therefore, if a future species of gecko were to develop setae all over its body as a form of heat insulation and energy conservation, something would need to be done with the setae to prevent their adhesive properties or else the gecko does stand a good chance of unintentionally getting some other part of its body stuck to a nearby object or flat surface. It may be possible for the gecko to develop some sort of dermal lubricant or film that could cover the setae and make them non-adhesive in places other than its toes, though. It is just a suggestion, but IMHO one worth considering. EDIT: Fixed the quote's title URL. For some reason this forum software won't allow me to use URL links as quotes. Edited by Ammonite, Jun 12 2010, 07:20 PM.
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| Margaret Pye | Jun 12 2010, 11:23 PM Post #28 |
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Adult
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Ok, I stand corrected. Sorry about the confusion. |
| My speculative dinosaur project. With lots of fluff, parental care and mammalian-level intelligence, and the odd sophont. | |
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| Toad of Spades | Jun 12 2010, 11:35 PM Post #29 |
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Clorothod
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Because of their brille, they could fly at high speeds without having to squint to keep wind from drying their eyes. Also they don't have to blink or worry about stuff getting in their eyes when chasing after prey in heavily forested areas and places with obstacles. This could make them very effective aerial predators when it comes to pursuing prey. Ways to improve on this is for them to evolve the brille thicker yet keeping them transparent. With transparent thick "goggles" over each eye, they could effectively wipe out the vision problems facing flying vertebrates. When they shed though, they should shed one at a time to prevent temporary blindness. As for shedding, would they still retain the lepidosaurian method of shedding while having a complex body covering? Edited by Toad of Spades, Jun 12 2010, 11:48 PM.
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Sorry Link, I don't give credit. Come back when you're a little...MMMMMM...Richer. Bread is an animal and humans are %90 aluminum. | |
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| Ammonite | Jun 21 2010, 06:32 PM Post #30 |
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Adolescent
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No problem
Possibly. The scales might fall off seperately instead of all at the same time like an endocast, with the setae still attached to them. The new coat of scales might show up underneath without setae at first, and new setae might grow in later. |
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Yeah, I can see them becoming an effective dermal covering now. If these geckos were able to evolve such a covering of cilia, would other parts be able to stick to flat surfaces as well? :O.o:


7:37 PM Jul 13