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The Moon, Pandora, from the film "Avatar"
Topic Started: Dec 20 2009, 02:13 PM (8,069 Views)
Yorick
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I took someone's suggestion and created another topic to speculate on the moon's inhabitants' evolution.

So...speculate!
"I believe, that whatever doesn't kill you, simply makes you...stranger"

-The Dark Knight (2008)
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zypher
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ach, I have not had time to read the post, but I figured I'd tell everyone that I am in the process of desigbing a six limbed, non humanoid version of the navi that beter resemble the rest of pandora's fauna...

if anyone cares...

I have one version compleeted, but I do't really think it works all that well, so I shall redesign my redesign... using refrence of images of the moon's other fauna to intergrate them into something more believable for that inviornment...

I just thought I'd let you all know...
because there are an infinite number of alternate realities, withen them an infinite ammount of infinite things are possible... infinitly.

two samples of my artwork
http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj74/zaraquexon/img016-1.jpg
http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj74/zaraquexon/img018.jpg

<embed width="384" height="206" bgcolor="#FFFFFF" src="http://www.spore.com/flash/csa_widget.swf?userid=2263016807&username=zaraquex&host=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.spore.com%2Fview%2Fuser-thumbnail" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" pluginspage="http://www.macromedia.com/go/getflashplayer" scale="showall" name="latest-creatures" /></embed>
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lamna
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The cannon is also described as using armor-piercing ammunition, whereas high explosive shells would be more devestating and probably be more effective as scaring away animals. Armor piercing ammo is used for just that, piercing armor. ;)

It depends really. HE rounds would be much more effective, in open terrain. In a forest I have a suspicion that they would become less useful. When hitting something like a branch they would explode, while a Armour-piercing round, or just a normal one was punch though.

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some even say that Na'vis are sexy

Would figure, since the Na'vi (specifically Neytiri) were apparently designed to appeal to "male fantasies".

Indeed, I read that Cameron kept tweaking Alien Love Interest (I'm terrible with names) until the majority of people he asked said they would bone her.

As for people not being able to empathize and connect with non-human characters? Meet the Tachikoma. They are light tanks/combat robots used by the Japanese Police in Ghost in the Shell: Stand Alone Complex and are based on jumping spiders.
Posted Image
And they are adorable, despite being nothing like people in looks, and not that much like them in thoughts either.
Heck people love Companion Cube, and he's just as box with hearts on it. He never tries to stab you though, so that's a plus.

I think the only reason they made them human looking is for the romance element. I mean if the Na'vi looked like Fookin' Prawns, people might not understand it unless the film was very well done.
Edited by lamna, Jan 5 2010, 10:13 AM.
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T.Neo
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When hitting soothing like a branch they would explode, while a Armour-piercing round, or just a normal one was punch though.


That is a very valid argument, although I don't see why AP rounds would be worth the trouble. Heavy machine guns (in 12.7 and 14.5mm calibre) often use incendiary rounds, so that could perhaps be a compromise between HE and an inert round.

AP rounds require a dense penetrator such as tungsten or depleted uranium. I just don't see why you'd go to all that trouble when the capability really isn't needed.

Quote:
 
I think the only reason they made them human looking is for the romance element. I mean if the Na'vi looked like Fookin' Prawns, people might not understand it unless the film was very well done.


Not only that, I could see people getting grossed out by it as well. I won't even go into the multitude of heavily disturbing "Wikus/Christopher" fan material out there on the net...

And it's "fokken", btw (singular "fok"). Take it from a South African. :P
A hard mathematical figure provides a sort of enlightenment to one's understanding of an idea that is never matched by mere guesswork.
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lamna
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True, I was just looking for an excuse. The real reason is probably that AP implies the Na'vi and Pandoran wildlife are really bad ass?

Indeed, though it might help with the racial parallel, aliens are quite good at getting people who aren't racist to understand it.

Ah, it would be. The Dutch love their double Ks. I keep finding our more and more chaps on this site (and KayKay who is a girl chap) are Commonwealth citizens. You live in South Africa or elsewhere? I only ask because I know we have a lot of South Africans in the UK who fled fearing a repeat of Rhodesia.
Edited by lamna, Jan 5 2010, 10:30 AM.
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T.Neo
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The real reason is probably that AP implies the Na'vi and Pandoran wildlife are really bad ass?


Perhaps. But then they'd have to be 8mm thick armorplate bad ass. :P

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You live in South Africa or elsewhere?


I happen to live in South Africa, yes.

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I only ask because I know we have a lot of South Africans in the UK who fled fearing a repeat of Rhodesia.


Well, they were somewhat misguided. While the situation in this country is somewhat deteriorating at present, the government is not set to pull off racist acts of the sort you're describing.

Rhodesia is now called Zimbabwe, btw. And an interesting parallel to the influx of South Africans into other commonwealth countries is the influx of Zimbabweans and people from other countries on the continent into South Africa...
A hard mathematical figure provides a sort of enlightenment to one's understanding of an idea that is never matched by mere guesswork.
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lamna
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Indeed, as I said by all rights the Na'vi should be blue pink mist by the end of the film.

I mean the in the closest parallel to the film, the Vietnam war, the Viet Cong lost pretty much every major battle their, and they had pretty modern technology. Then again, they did not have dragons.

No I mean a repeat of what happened to Rhodesia in the process of becoming Zimbabwe. Rhodesia used to be very economically successful (Also it not as racist as RSA, Ian Smith was just trying to prevent the kind of violent political upheaval in Africa at the time of decolonization.) but when Rhodesia got majority rule and became Zimbabwe Mugabe basically ruined the economy by taking away farms from white farmers, who knew what they were doing and gave them to people who did not. As you can see the decline is still happening.
Lots of White South Africans were worried that the same with would happen in South Africa, so far though things seem to be going rather well though.
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Are nipples or genitals necessary, lamna?
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T.Neo
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Indeed. The Na'vi simply don't stand a chance against humans, and frankly I don't see the wildlife as being that effective either.

It's like the movie "Evolution". The scientists find a way of killing the aliens with a substance that is toxic to their biochemistry (in this case a certain brand of shampoo. Woo for product placement :P ) but (more or less) harmless to humans.

The Pandoran biochemistry seems to be somewhat different to that of Earth, so it is entirely possible that a certain chemical is deadly to them but harmless to us.

It's far more effective then trying to shoot at those nasty pterodactyls with missles and machine guns. Just spray them with the biospecific toxin, and they fall to the ground.

You could also genetically engineer a species of bacterium (terran or pandoran) to produce this toxin from in-situ materials (read: plants, animals, organic detritus), so that once you've release it into the environment, you just sit back and watch.
A hard mathematical figure provides a sort of enlightenment to one's understanding of an idea that is never matched by mere guesswork.
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lamna
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Luckily Evolution does not take itself seriously otherwise that would have just been ridiculous. You can find much more selenium in toner, and it's a found in a compound in shampoo might not be toxic. I mean Salt is much safer than Sodium.

Chemical weapons are generally not that useful, though the Italians did find them handy in Ethiopia in general they are very hard to use. And when they work you are generally condemned for doing so.

Also it's clear the people don't want to destroy Pandora. If they did they would have landed guns blazing. They make every effort to get the Na'vi to move rather than just go in guns blazing. Even if they are being entirely selfish it would be silly to abandon the Na'vi who could be cheap labour, the forest which could contain useful resources for Biotechnology and the possibility of tourism.

Also the RDA upholds the Outer Space Treaty, and so is prohibited from using WMD's, which includes chemical and biological weapons.

Oh and I read they don't use HE rounds to prevent collateral damage.
http://james-camerons-avatar.wikia.com/wiki/GAU-90
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Yorick
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That simply isn't the case, as people around the world do it all the time.


Not the way a filmmaker intends for you to do so.

Let's say I made a show about an alien that was stranded on Earth and we followed it's struggles to assimilate to life on Earth and try to reach home.

We wouldn't be able to relate to it if it was some freaky-looking non-humanoid thing. I'd either have to create some contrivance like in "Star Trek" where the alien looked just like a human but only with pointy ears or keep the alien's original body non-humanoid but have it take the appearance and the identity of deceased or missing human or make it a shape-shifter that assumes human form.

Quote:
 
It's like the movie "Evolution". The scientists find a way of killing the aliens with a substance that is toxic to their biochemistry (in this case a certain brand of shampoo. Woo for product placement :P ) but (more or less) harmless to humans.


Whoa! I must be psychic! I was randomly just thinking about this movie only this morning!
"I believe, that whatever doesn't kill you, simply makes you...stranger"

-The Dark Knight (2008)
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lamna
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That film you are talking about has been made. It was called E.T. and the beast in that film was not very human. Oh it had the basics but that creature was not a person with an amusing shaped head and strange coloured skin.

Their also made a film with a similer premise called Homeward Bound. And the characters in that are not very human like at all. People relate to alien forms quite well as long as the aliens have human-ish minds.

Also what do you think would happen after the film? I think the RDA would be hacked up and nationalized, and then a government (USA? North American Union? United Nations?) would take over and return and try again.
I think the RDA was limited on what weapons it could take to Pandora, and when the government come it brings in proper weapons, ground attack aircraft, tanks, APCs, Bombers, artillery.
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Holben
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What was the unobtanium used for anyway?

Did you say floating monorails earlier?
Time flows like a river. Which is to say, downhill. We can tell this because everything is going downhill rapidly. It would seem prudent to be somewhere else when we reach the sea.

"It is the old wound my king. It has never healed."
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lamna
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It is a stable, strong superconductor that is also magnetic unlike ones that can be made on earth and is important in power production and transport, including interstellar craft.
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Oceaniis
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It isn't just a strong superconductor, it's a room temperature superconductor!
Since known superconductor just act like one at freezing -200ºC bellow zero! and are ordinary stones at room temperature
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Holben
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I thought there was a -170 degree one?

By power production, is it better than good old rocket fuel?
Time flows like a river. Which is to say, downhill. We can tell this because everything is going downhill rapidly. It would seem prudent to be somewhere else when we reach the sea.

"It is the old wound my king. It has never healed."
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lamna
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From what I gather it's not used as a power source, but in matter-antimatter engines and probably other things as well.
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