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EV Guide for Competitive Pokemon Masters--Abridged
Topic Started: Nov 10 2009, 09:34 PM (545 Views)
Salavoir55 Nov 10 2009, 09:34 PM Post #1
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This guide is for those who know it all except for possibly (unlikely) what I am about to type about EV spreads. I abridged it because no one will read it otherwise. If you're an expert, why waste your time reading a long guide? To create expert EV spreads that are beyond the already egregious skills of you competitive Pokemon masters, follow the following steps so long as they apply to your Pokemon (1 and 7-9 apply to all). A link to the unabridged portions follows each step.

1.)Think about what you want your Pokemon to do. Set a useful goal for the Pokemon first. Make sure it's possible to achieve through damage calculators such as: http://ownpurpose.com/libelldra/damage_calculator.html Choose the nature you think you'll need at this stage. Unabridged.

2.)Find something important to outspeed. If your Pokemon is too slow or a wall like Cresselia, this is less important. It depends on your goal though. There's no point in putting speed on wallish Pokemon like resttalk Cresselia or Crocune since (a) it's useless to their purpose and (b) it will be useless nearly every time. They get more use by putting those EVs in defenses (including HP). Maximizing speed when the spare EVs are useless elsewhere is fine (e.g. CB Weavile). Unabridged.

3.)Find something important to NHKO. OHKO, 2HKO, OHKO with SR, etc. Very important for sweepers, somewhat important for tanks, and less important for walls. It depends on your Pokemon's purpose. Maxing the offense of sweepers is fine. Stuff with awful offense generally ignore this step. Unabridged.

4.)Find something important to survive. Very important for tankish and bulky sweeperish Pokemon. For Pokemon like Snorlax and Skamory, maximize their defensive potential in accordance with your original goal. For frail Pokemon like Weavile and Gengar, you generally don't need to bother with this since it will be (a) a waste of EVs to survive something or (b) they won't be able to survive it anyways.

5.)If you want to maximize defenses, max HP first. If it has loads of HP relative to its defenses, you don't need to max it (e.g. Snorlax, Blissey). If it doesn't, you must max it (e.g. Dusknoir, Rotom-A). If it's in-between (e.g. Latias, Metagross), you can go for a lefties point, but only do so if it (a) provides better defense (rarely happens) or (b) provides those smidgen of EVs necessary to KO or outspeed a threat in accordance with steps 2-3. If your Pokemon is weak to SR or takes neutral and runs items that do not affect its health (Choiced item, Expert Belt, Berry, etc.), don't make its HP divisible by 4 if the former and don't make its HP divisible by 8 if the latter. Those rules don't apply if you have Sandstorm or hail on your team and your Pokemon is weak to it. Don't bother with "minimum Life Orb recoil." So long as HP isn't divisible by 10, you're fine.

6.)In maxmizing defenses, put EVs in defense last. For all Pokemon but Pokemon like Blissey and Snorlax, this is true. To maximize defenses, find what combination of the EVs that you still have left split between HP and defenses gives you the best defensive potential.* Note that 128 / 128 is often bad.

7.)Be economical. Use the combination of EVs which gives you the most out of them.....EVERY TIME!!! That means you may find that your originally intended nature must be changed at this stage of EVing or that you can do more with your EVs than your original goal. Consequently, your EV spread and maybe goal needs to be changed. If so, go back to step 1. Also make sure each EV placement has a reason backing it. Stuff like "enough to outspeed x, maxed HP, enough to OHKO y, rest dumped in Defense" is fine provided outspeeding x, max HP, and KOing y is useful and viable.

8.)Extra EVs and gaining them. Use extra EVs to hit jump points. Or if you need or want extra EVs, hit a jump point in one stat you originally had maxed or hit the nearest jump point you can while still doing something specific in accordance with step 2-4 and your original goal. The former is the usual situation, hence splits like 176 / 80 or 216 / 40. Hitting lefties points gives extra EVs, but they have been discussed already. Also, use 252 > 255.

9.)Remember: think > goal > specification > optimization > bonuses. Stop in the chain when you run out of EVs, obviously. Speed is usually the first step of specification, but all this has already been discussed. A combination of experience, your team, knowledge of whether a Pokemon is outclassed at what it's doing or of whether it's doing too much to be effective, and Shoddy statistics/Smogon's movesets will help you determine "usefulness," "stuff to aim for," and "viability." Also, useful speed tiers and Smogon's OU, Ubers, UU, and Little Cup speed tiers.


If this guide is a hit, I'll continue with my "Abridged Series for Competitive Pokemon Masters" in a future installment.

*APPENDIX
This will explain what I mean by defensive potential (VERY similar to "Statistical (Special) Defense") and will give examples of EV spreads. Only read this part if you need examples, don't know what in the world defensive potential is, or are simply interested. Reading this appendix makes the guide much less abridged. Note that the concept of defensive potential is slightly flawed due to game rounding, and so it should not be used when making very precise spreads.

Determining defensive potential (e.g. determining whether one combination of HP and SDef is better than another combination of HP and SDef on the special side) is quite simple. Multiply your Pokemon's HP stat by one of its Defense stats to get a number. Try a different combination of HP and that same defensive stat then multiply them again. Compare the two numbers: (the larger number x 100 / the smaller number) - 100 = combination that created the larger number is w% better than the combination that created the smaller number.

Or you can use: the smaller number x 100 / the larger number = combination that created the smaller number takes hits w% as well as the combination that created the larger number. Offensive potential (e.g. determining whether a given SAtk stat and move is better than the same SAtk and another move (or a different SAtk and same move) on the special side) is similar and is compared with the exact same formulas. The numbers you use are found by multiplying an attack stat by the base power of the appropriate move. In both cases, the larger the number you get from multiplication, the better the defensive or offensive potential is.

Examples of EV spreads

Posted Image
Jirachi @ Leftovers
EVs: ???
-Wish
-U-Turn
-Stealth Rock
-Zen Headbutt/Iron Head/Ice Punch

I start by figuring out what I want it to do. It's obviously supposed to be bulky. Taking two DD LO Salamence Outrages and an Adamant CB Dugtrio EQ (to get off one last Wish if timed right) isn't a bad idea either. To start, I max the HP. I then find how many EVs I need to survive that from an Adamant LO Salamence by using a damage calculator, since I know it will hit harder than Dugtrio. I start by maxing defense and using an Impish nature and check the damage. I then lower my defensive EVs by and repeat again and again. Doing this, I find I need an Impish nature and 140 EVs in Defense to survive this after SR damage.

Since Jirachi reaches 236 Speed with a neutral nature and 0 EVs, a reasonable speed to aim for is 245, outrunning both Jolly Max speed Tyranitar and those trying to outrun it by 1 point. This requires 36 EVs. I then dump the rest in SDef to soften special attacking blows, giving: 252 HP / 140 Def / 80 SDef / 36 Speed. From experience, I know Jirachi can survive attacks from LO Gengar given enough EVs. I check to see how close Jirachi is to surviving it. Jirachi survives it well, so I see how well it survives consecutive Shadow Ball and Hidden Power [Fire] (after Jirachi switches into an obvious Shadow Ball or Focus Blast, HP [Fire] would be Gengar's next reasonable move).

It turns out it barely survives (outside of SR). So, I play with the EVs between HP and SDef until it survives it the best it can. I do not lower the HP less than 401 HP though because 401 Hp allows Jirachi to take 5 consecutive Seismic Tosses. Seems situational, but it's a small investment, so I might as well aim for it. I find that 404 HP and 257 SDef gives Jirachi the best chance it has at surviving LO Gengar's moves and allows it to barely survive inside of SR. I check to see the difference in damage I take from Salamence and Dugtrio, and I see that there is now a 0.07% chance of Jirachi not surviving Salamence. This is pretty much zero chance, so the final spread is 252 HP / 136 Def / 84 SDef / 36 Speed Impish.
Edited by Salavoir55, Jan 26 2010, 10:56 PM.
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zapper22001 Dec 26 2009, 06:42 PM Post #2
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WARNING: The Defensive Potential Formula is flawed due to rounding issues and therefore should not be used when making precise EV spreads.

Max HP vs. Lefties Point

When Eving a Defensive Pokemon, there are two crucial points to consider: maxing the HP or going for a Lefties Point. Maxing HP allows for greater defenses while hitting a Lefties Point means that you recover 1 more HP each turn from Leftovers and almost every defensive Pokemon carries Leftovers.(Skarmory is the only exception I can think of).

Note: Leftovers recovers 1/16th of your health each turn so a Lefties Point would make the HP divisible by 16. This allows the Pokemon to recover the full amount of health because there is no fraction. If there is a fraction when recovering HP from Lefties, the fraction does not get counted so you lose HP. In a sense, by not hitting the Lefties Point, you are lowering your Pokemon's defensive ability.

Recovering more HP would help in the long run, but as a wall, your main goal is to take hits so Maxing HP might seem like a better choice. Now both of these allow the Pokemon to maximize its defenses, but which one is better and in what circumstances is it better? Glancing back at the original post, you find that Steps 5 and 6 address Defensive Potential.

Salavior55
 
5.)If you want to maximize defenses, max HP first. If it has loads of HP relative to its defenses, you don't need to max it (e.g. Snorlax, Blissey). If it doesn't, you must max it (e.g. Dusknoir, Rotom-A). If it's in-between (e.g. Latias, Metagross), you can go for a lefties point, but only do so if it (a) provides better defense (rarely happens) or (b) provides those smidgen of EVs necessary to KO or outspeed a threat in accordance with steps 2-3. If your Pokemon is weak to SR or takes neutral and runs items that do not affect its health (Choiced item, Expert Belt, Berry, etc.), don't make its HP divisible by 4 if the former and don't make its HP divisible by 8 if the latter. Those rules don't apply if you have Sandstorm or hail on your team and your Pokemon is weak to it. Don't bother with "minimum Life Orb recoil." So long as HP isn't divisible by 10, you're fine.

6.)In maxmizing defenses, put EVs in defense last. For all Pokemon but Pokemon like Blissey and Snorlax, this is true. To maximize defenses, find what combination of the EVs that you still have left split between HP and defenses gives you the best defensive potential.* Note that 128 / 128 is often bad.

Now this two steps give you guidelines to follow when finding Pokemon's maximum defensive potential.

However, to fully illustrate the difference in defensive potentional between Maxing HP and Lefties Point, an example will be provided. It is the spread from the example in the original post.

Salavior55
 
Posted Image
Jirachi @ Leftovers
EVs: ???
-Wish
-U-Turn
-Stealth Rock
-Zen Headbutt/Iron Head/Ice Punch

I start by figuring out what I want it to do. It's obviously supposed to be bulky. Taking two DD LO Salamence Outrages and an Adamant CB Dugtrio EQ (to get off one last Wish if timed right) isn't a bad idea either.


Now that we know what to do, we must find an EV spread that suits the requirements. At first glance, we find that there are two spreads that fit the requirements, but which one has maximum defensive potential?

1st Spread:
240 HP / 140 Def / 92 SDef / 36 Speed Impish


2nd Spread:
252 HP / 136 Def / 84 SDef / 36 Speed Impish

The first spread uses Max Hp to achieve its goal while the second spread aims for a Lefties Point so which is better?

To find out you must compare damage calculations.

1st:
(+1 LO Mence Outrage vs [240]401 HP / [140]298 Def)
Raw damage: 171 185 201
Percentages: 42.64% 46.13% 50.12%
99.93% chance of survival in SR.

2nd:
(+1 LO Mence Outrage vs [252]404 HP / [136]297 Def)
Raw damage: 171 186 202
Percentages: 42.33% 46.04% 50.00%
99.93% chance of survival in SR

1st:
(LO Gengar vs [240]401HP / [92]259 SDef)
Shadow Ball
Raw damage: 154 168 183
Percentages: 38.40% 41.90% 45.64%

2nd:
(LO Gengar vs [252]404HP / [84]257 SDef)
Shadow Ball
Raw damage: 156 169 184
Percentages: 38.61% 41.83% 45.54%

1st:
(LO Gengar vs [240]401HP / [92]259 SDef)
Focus Blast
Raw damage: 155 168 183
Percentages: 38.65% 41.90% 45.64%

2nd:
(LO Gengar vs [252]404HP / [84]257 SDef)
Focus Blast
Raw damage: 156 169 184
Percentages: 38.61% 41.83% 45.54%

1st:
(LO Gengar vs [240]401HP / [92]259 SDef)
HP [Fire]
Raw damage: 180 196 214
Percentages: 44.89% 48.88% 53.37%

2nd:
(LO Gengar vs [252]404HP / [84]257 SDef)
HP [Fire]
Raw damage: 180 196 214
Percentages: 44.55% 48.51% 52.97%

So after comparing the damage calculations, the 2nd Spread: 252 HP / 136 Def / 84 SDef / 36 Speed Impish appears to take hits better so it has reached maximum defensive potential.

For further reading on defensive and offensive potential, read this thread by Salavior55. http://s1.zetaboards.com/Brock/single/?p=303724&t=1988596
Edited by zapper22001, Dec 31 2009, 08:26 PM.
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zapper22001 Jan 26 2010, 10:49 PM Post #3
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originally posted by Rhys29 on Sppf
 

(3)Scoring The Kill
     
Ever since the introduction of Platinum, the whole metagame has taken a massive offensive turn. In order to counter and deal with certain threats effectively, having a sure fire way to take down a common opponent in an attack or two is vital to most teams. This is an essential factor to keep in mind for basically any set that has an attack which deals damage.

Do keep in mind this is far more important for offensive sets than defensive.[/indent]
~Consider~
     For sets designed to sweep an opponent's team, this is a very important step to focus on. This is the step where you decide what investment you will make on your offenses.

Odds are you will be doing several calculations to make sure you can score KO's on specific threats, so a handy damage calculator will be your best friend. Libelldra has a phenomenal damage calculator with easy user interface.

There are almost too many threats to invest into taking down, so for reference have a list of the top threats of your tier at hand. One of the best things you can do is constantly check, favorite, or memorize the top threats in the shoddy statistics provided by the dedicated DougJustDoug from Smogon. You can click here to find a list of all the tier stats for the months and past months if you're curious and looking for a history lesson or trends.
~Apply~
     Here are two factors to include when sizing up the amount of damage your set will deal.

Entry Hazards – Check your team for the moves Stealth Rock and Spikes. These attacks are called ‘entry hazards’. They deal damage to opponents switching in, or entering combat. If a Pokemon in your lead spot has either one of these moves, there is a good chance that an opponent will be taking damage every time they switch. Keeping this in mind will help you ease into KO’s.

Easing into KO’s means you don’t have to assure dealing 100% damage to score a kill. A good example would be Ice Punch Lucario. One of Lucario’s best counters has been Zapdos since it can wall Lucario without too much of a hassle and score OHKO with Heat Wave. When Swords Dance, Ice Punch Lucario was first initially introduced to the metagame, it ran a Jolly set to outrun Zapdos and Salamence sets which were built to outrun Adamant Lucario. However a Jolly Lucario, after a Swords Dance as Zapdos switches in, can only manage 81% ~ 95% on the most defensive Zapdos set, which under normal circumstances would never score a KO. However Zapdos is weak to Rock type which means it takes a hefty 25% as it switches in. Even after a turn of Leftovers recovery, Jolly Lucario can score a OHKO with a +2 Ice Punch as long as Stealth Rock is down.

Make sure you always include entry hazards when showing your calculations as well. If you find you will score just as many KO’s with less investment into your attacking stats as long as you have entry hazards out with the set you currently have, don’t be afraid to shuffle some of the Ev’s around.

Weather Effects – Weather can drastically change how battles will play out and every good battler should be aware of what it can do to their team. The most common by far is Sandstorm thanks to Hippowdon and the popular Tyranitar’s Sand Stream ability. This is why most teams usually include a large amount of team members who are either Rock, Ground, or Steel, making them immune to Sandstorm damage.

The key component to keep in mind when dealing with Sandstorm is that it deals damage before end of turn items activate. If a Pokemon not immune to Sandstorm is down to 6.25% or less at the end of the turn, it will faint from the buffetting Sandstorm before Leftovers recovery could put it in the clear. Here is an example of how this would work.

An Adamant Tyranitar with a Life Orb with +1 Attack thanks to Dragon Dance is about to attack with Crunch while the opponent switches in a 252/252 HP/Def Cresselia, which switched into Stealth Rock (not the most likely situation but it’s just an example). Crunch from this Tyranitar would deal 366 – 432 damage (or 82.43% - 97.30%), not assuring a OHKO even with Stealth Rock damage included (82.43 + 12.5 = 95.93%: minimum damage). However before Cresselia can recover with Leftovers at the end of the turn, the Sandstorm will deal an additional 6.25%, scoring the OHKO (95.93 + 6.25 = 102.18%: minimum damage). If you have Sandstorm on your team, it may be a good idea to take this into account before finalizing your calculations.

Hail, the exclusive cousin to Sandstorm, has the same damage effect. The only difference is the types taking damage each turn: only Ice remains untouched. Luckily, Abomasnow, the only Pokemon family gifted with the ability Snow Warning, is a very uncommon sight. Only teams based around Hail should pay any attention to this affect. Hail does 6.25% as well and hits at the same time Sandstorm does, so KO’s can be eased into a bit more efficiently.

The two remaining weather effects, Sun and Rain, are both very similar to each other. Sun powers up Fire type moves by 1.5x and reduces Water attacks by 1.5x while Rain does the exact opposite. This gives both a large offensive and defensive boost to teams based around these effects and all calculations on these teams should include these weather effects.[/indent]

~Reconsider/Reapply~
     Make sure your offensive investment can work with your other previously set investments. If they clash, you may have to choose one over the other. If you are unsure which takes priority, check back to your purpose and if you still can't choose go to a more advanced player for advice.


Edited by zapper22001, Jan 26 2010, 11:16 PM.
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