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| celestial realm what is it?; celestial realm | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Dec 15 2012, 02:03 PM (773 Views) | |
| davids1993 | Dec 15 2012, 02:03 PM Post #1 |
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Hi there I'm new to atenism and trying to find out about what the basis of everything is. Can anyone explain what the celestial realm is and the link between the horizon of light? Many thanks Adonai |
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| AmarnaGirl | Dec 15 2012, 07:21 PM Post #2 |
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Welcome to the forums - it's been very quiet around here lately,so it's always nice to have new people! Atenism (from my own studies anyway) is kinda tricky in the sense that we really don't have as much information on Atenist theology as we do about the rest of the ancient Egyptian pantheon,plus there's always the addition of modern aspects from the few people who might still worship Aten today. (I've seen a few websites out there,whose theological ideas I would definitely say are a very 21st century take on Atenism,and not as Akhenaten originally had it.) As far as I know (and I could be wrong,I'll probably need to search some more) the "horizon of light" can most likely refer to some afterlife concept of Atenism,(which was actually a rather vague issue in Akhenaten's time - Atenism didn't have much of a celestial afterlife idea)or even the literal horizon of the sun's light that we can see when it rises and sets every day. (Akhenaten didn't seem to have developed much theology in the way of his belief system - we know bits and pieces,but there's a lot missing from the story.) Have you read the Great Hymn to the Aten yet? It was said to possibly have been written by Akhenaten himself,and pretty much lays out his thoughts on the whole matter. I think it might be posted somewhere here in the forums,if not I'll try to find a link to it. (you could also look on the Fellowship blog - I think the forum owner may have posted a copy there some time ago.) Edited by AmarnaGirl, Dec 15 2012, 07:40 PM.
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| davids1993 | Dec 16 2012, 04:54 AM Post #3 |
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Hi there Thanks for replying and yes I have just read the great hymn is interesting stuff. Have you also read the hymn to the aten? Is extremely similar to psalm 104 which probley shows that Hebrews were influenced by the aten.also with the horizon of light after studying you think it could be the name for the celestial realm? In modern orthodox atenism? Otherwise el amarna was called horizon of the aten which could be another name for horizon of aten? All speculation of course lol Regards David Adonai |
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| AmarnaGirl | Dec 16 2012, 10:38 PM Post #4 |
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Yes, I've read the hymn also - a beautiful piece. (it's quite a popular theory that the Great Hymn influenced the writing of Psalm 104 - and it very well could have,there was a Jewish population in Egypt for several hundred years or so,so it might be a possibility. But by the time that psalm was written,some hundreds of years later,the Aten was long gone from the Egyptian pantheon - removed during the reign of Horemheb. So it's hard to say if the Jewish people were influenced by the Aten or not. Unfortunately,we just don't know. Maybe some ideas had trickled down in bits and pieces,but Aten worship was pretty effectively squashed after Akhenaten's death.) The Horizon of Light could possibly be another name for the celestial realm (that actually does sound like something I vaguely recall off the Temple of Aten website - the Orthodox Atenist Assembly. The website's still up,however they seem to be a defunct group now,as far as I know. Though you could always try contacting them to know for sure.) Akhenaten probably had reasons of his own for calling his city "Horizon of the Aten." He specifically wanted a site that had never been claimed by another god/goddess. He claimed he was led to the site by the Aten (sort of a divine revelation,if you will),the city was in the east (direction of sunrise),and I also remember reading from an archaeology magazine article (online somewhere) that the silhouette of the cliffs behind the city,cut in the middle by deep valleys,could be viewed as the representation of the hieroglyph for "horizon." (But the article did say this was probably a modern interpretation.) Go figure,LOL. Edited by AmarnaGirl, Dec 17 2012, 02:42 PM.
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| davids1993 | Dec 17 2012, 05:55 PM Post #5 |
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Yeah that's interesting about the site of amarna and is true that it was due to it being a virgin site. Whats your view about a possible solar eclipse that pushed akhenatens ideology to build a new city and become monolistic? That was a theory and a good read by William mcmurray. Obviously the proof is in the pudding so to speak in terms of evidence. Also with the aten itself looking into some of the inscriptions I can see a similarity to the Christian god with how he is said to be loving and caring which was unusual for an Egyptian deity. David |
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| AmarnaGirl | Dec 17 2012, 10:42 PM Post #6 |
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I can't really say about a solar eclipse - unless there was documentation from the time that an eclipse happened during his rule,it's really all speculation. From my point of view,what I've studied so far - I think part of the reason,at least,was that Akhenaten wanted to curb the power of the Amun cult,whose priests by that time had grown more powerful than the Pharaoh. I think in that regard,Akhenaten knew what he was doing when he shut down the Amun temples - by cutting off the priests' power,he in effect curbed their influence,and reminded the people that it was the king who was supposed to rule,not the priests (unfortunately,he ultimately failed to make his point - he was not a good king for his country,and the real power eventually reverted back to the priesthood.) Save for the point of the Aten seeming to be the sole god focus (after Year 9,anyway) I'm not sure I see much similarity between the Christian god. The Aten wasn't meant to be a loving and caring god (though,I personally don't really see the Christian god as being loving and caring either,for that matter,so I guess they could be similar in that way also.) The Aten was in reality a very distant,unknowable deity for the Egyptian people. They could understand it as a minor cult deity,one of many aspects and representations of sun gods. It changed appearance several times (had 2 or 3 different representations during Akhenaten's reign alone),but was always a very shadowy type figure that the people really couldn't relate to during Akhenaten's tenure. There were other Egyptian deities in the pantheon that were far more caring to the Egyptians. (If the Aten was a "loving" deity,it was meant only for Akhenaten,not for others. Atenism in Egypt was really all about Akhenaten himself. It was a cult of personality.) Granted,modern Atenists today (what few there seem to be,LOL) have a very different view of the Aten and its' qualities than the ancients did. Edited by AmarnaGirl, Dec 20 2012, 04:35 PM.
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| AmarnaGirl | Dec 20 2012, 04:43 PM Post #7 |
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bumping this one up,'cause I think I messed up in posting,and there's no way to delete,LOL! |
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| AmarnaGirl | Dec 25 2012, 09:47 PM Post #8 |
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I am bringing David's post back up,it's an interesting discussion - hopefully we can continue it!
Edited by AmarnaGirl, Dec 26 2012, 07:04 PM.
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| Maaritaten | Apr 27 2013, 07:09 PM Post #9 |
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Most of the times I come across 'horizon of Aten' in any of the texts it is in a context that would lend credence to the theory of it being a some kind of paradisial afterlife. There's one particular line in one of the northern tombs, in a prayer for the deceased's ba, that goes 'in Akhetaten/Horizon of Aten, your ETERNAL capital'. I think the earthly Akhetaten was supposed to mirror a celestial reality. |
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'Let me be satisfied seeing You, Oh Living Aten!' - adapted from the Hymn of Tutu, Chamberlain of the Two Lands | |
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