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UAW's bail out
Topic Started: Nov 18 2008, 07:01 AM (2,248 Views)
DaisyLover

Bigtoe
Nov 21 2008, 10:46 PM
Hah! You guys (and gal) are really obsessed with Manna. Nope- not him. I don't like Vegas, don't play golf, don't drink much and don't take picutres of my food. (that's kind of weird- no offense Gringa.) But go ahead and speculate Daisy.
:ROFL:
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dumblonde
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archer
Nov 21 2008, 11:07 PM
I don't disagree with you bigtoe....just wondering if the big three fail if there will be any money left for the retirees or will the taxpayers pick up the tab? And could those benefits be restructured like many other companies have done? there are no easy answers when big companies like this fail......I don't see a bailout solving their long term problems......and I don't see management ever coming to grips with the way things are now as opposed to the way things have always been....We are all going to be sacrificing something over the next few years I think.

Of course they have obligations to their former employees.....but if the company is gone, what happens to those obligations?

The companies used to have to secure these pensions- now they've been allowed to pillage the trust funds (not unlike the govt has done to SSA) and then renege on these agreements while still tooling around in their private jets and gifting each other with obscene benefit packages. Bail out the companies- fire the execs. They bring nothing to the table.
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Yhitzak
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And all of this seems to keep coming back to entitlement. On the one hand, it's shameful for companies to reneg on their contracts to their former employees. On the other hand, times change and contracts must reflect the changes of the times. GM has not done that. Most large companies have not cut the proper corners (i.e. reducing pensions, salaries, and bonuses for their top execs), and have instead cut the worst corners possible. What I mean about entitlement is that people seem to believe that because they did their time, they deserve whatever rewards. And this isn't an entirely outrageous assumption to make, but at what point is enough enough? For anyone anywhere? And if the resources for those benefits just don't exist, what possible solution is there to this problem?
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Gringa
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I am all for capitalism and feel if a company is going under, let them go. But, as I am watching the government sling billions and billions ( or should I say TRILLIONS) into the bankers pockets, who seemingly are hoarding the money and buying assets or lining pockets, I have having a hard time staying on my capitalistic course here.

Seems to me that "saving" the Big 3 is in the best interest of the people. Why is Capital Hill fighting it, yet catapulting money into bankers pockets faster then they can print it? At this point, it seems to me that if the government is for it, we need to be against it... and vice versa.

Loan or give them the money - fire the executives, rehire without a promise of huge bonuses, everyone takes a paycut and reduction in benefits, including retirees, renegotiate all outsourcing contracts - in other words - revamp the whole damn thing and keep people working.

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